If your SCV is the same as mine, the ball bearings and springs will fall out if you take the assembly off without removing the two screws first. With a clean garage floor that shouldn't be an issue, but I think on re-assembly, you will probably need to pull the spring screws, then attach the cap, then install ball bearings, springs, and spring screws as they rest against the plunging valve rod.

And,

 

If your SCV is the same as mine, the ball bearings and springs will fall out if you take the assembly off without removing the two screws first. With a clean garage floor that shouldn't be an issue, but I think on re-assembly, you will probably need to pull the spring screws, then attach the cap, then install ball bearings, springs, and spring screws as they rest against the plunging valve rod.

Jere,
Excellent, thank you! Is it as simple as a proper cleaning and grease?




Andreas

 

That has worked for me. The small springs that hold the valve in float mode could easily be impinged by hardened grease and not properly pushing their ball bearings against the plunge rod and holding it forward of the compression washer. OTOH, I suppose they just could be no longer strong enough, and might need to be replaced. But, first step, clean old grease, replace with fresh. I'd bet on that being a resolution.

 

The problem could also be corrosion or wear. Water vapour has a tendency to collect in that area and can rust the springs and ball to the point of failure. Also is the possibility that the ball has worn down the edges of the groove of the indent in the spool through use of the float position.

In any event, removal, disassembly, cleaning, and inspection are required whatever the root problem happens to be.

 

I did the deed today. Removed the spring screws & springs and pulled the cap. Things were dry and gummed up within. The ball bearings were stuck in their respective bores...

I degreased & scrubbed the spool spring and shaft, and then thoroughly cleaned the cap, spring screws, springs and balls (a 3/16" drill bit, spun with fingers, was perfect to clean out the spring screw cups). Then I bead blasted the cap, washed it, etch primed it and painted it.

Reassembled using some waterproof cycle grease and it works as new. :fing32:

















Andreas

 

Well done!! :thThumbsU

 

Thank you sir.

Great work, you've set a high standard. My pictures have suddenly become inadequate.

Now, now. Your inadequate pics gave me the inspiration to tear into my SCV!




Andreas

 

Great work, you've set a high standard. My pictures have suddenly become inadequate.

 

Well, even after this top-shelf float/detent rebuild, I found that the lever would still pop out of position once every few times. I figured that the 13-year old springs were slightly fatigued, so I removed one of the spring caps and ran to the local Ace. There I was able to fine very small washers that fit perfectly into the bore of the spring cap (I don't remember what size they were labeled as but can get that info). I placed two washers in each spring cap and used the butt of a 3/16" drill bit to ensure they were fully seated.

Then I reinstalled the caps and shoved the lever forward. Success! The lever goes into float with authority now and stays there. I'm thrilled with my small stroke of genius.







Andreas

 

Couldn't you just have slightly stretched the spring? Or better yet find an exact spring on McMaster Carr.

 

I could have, but the springs are very tight and very small. I felt shimming would give better control of the outcome.




Andreas

 

One year later and the lever is starting to pop out of float on occasion. Since I never did find a source for the springs, I'll fiddle with another shim or two...




Andreas

 

Andreas,
Hope you have a warm place to do this work. It's a shame the float valve is primarily a winter use, and therefore gets notice, and repair actions in cold garages.

Good luck, be nice if we had a nice warm sunny day for your work before the next snow. FWIW, and I know that wouldn't likely be all that much, mine has stayed rock solid since the time I worked it last a couple years ago. (Knock on wood). I'm running double duty this winter switching back and forth between blade and grapple

Jere

 

Jere,
Yes, clean warm garage.

I'll take it apart again, clean & grease, and add another washer or two before I drop $100+ on the 'detent kit'...




Andreas

 

Andreas, I reviewed your "washer" repair with interest as I cleaned and lubed my SCV, looked at replacing balls (they were fine) and it is still not holding in consistently. I didn't get the washer fix done before fall so will look at in the spring. Like you, I'm unwilling to spend $80 for the kit when I think all I really need are the two new uncompressed springs. Do you have the capability to get good spring measurements so we can do some research on just replacing those. Certainly, wire size, number of coils, and uncompressed length.. not sure how we could measure spring force constant. I think they have what are termed "ground" ends.

Just thinking it would be good to post this info while you have apart. Thanks

 

^ I'll take some physical measurements but am unsure of spring rate/strength.

I wonder if these parts are available from the manufacturer of the SCV (Eaton, etc.)?




Andreas

 

I made a feeble attempt that a while back and arrived at:

QCC Acquires Sauer-Danfoss Dukes Valves
http://www.qualitycontrolcorp.com/about-us/news-articles/qcc-acquires-sauer-danfoss-dukes-valves

And I think QCC makes the kit JD sells. You can find people selling the QCC part. I haven't pursued whether they would just sell the springs out of kit

 

I made a feeble attempt that a while back and arrived at:

QCC Acquires Sauer-Danfoss Dukes Valves
http://www.qualitycontrolcorp.com/about-us/news-articles/qcc-acquires-sauer-danfoss-dukes-valves

And I think QCC makes the kit JD sells. You can find people selling the QCC part. I haven't pursued whether they would just sell the springs out of kit

I know this is an old tread, but did you ever find a source of the QCC Kit, The OEM JD part is now over $250.

 

I had this same problem last year. Added the spacer and all was good. Today my lever is starting to pop out of float again.

 

With this many of these issues, I think we need to take a run at identifying a source for these springs. I would guess we could scrounge up a minimum order.

Andreas, please look carefully at the "piston" with the "belly" to see if any wear on that could be causing popping out. That is also in kit and likely reason for high price.

 

Will do. Just came home with a few more of my special washers.

I'll also check to make sure the detent shaft hasn't somehow loosened from the spool it's threaded into.

The instructions posted above are dated 1992!




Andreas

 

Andreas, inspect the spool. If the ball has worn a groove in the detent mechanism, pull the spool, rotate it 180°, and put it back together without the shims and try it out.

 

Bob,
I thought about that as well, but there are two ball bearings, on opposing sides. Ran out of time today to mess with this. Hopefully I can tear into it tomorrow.




Andreas

 

I finally had time today to pull the detent mechanism. It still looked like I left it a year ago, clean & greased.

Instead of buttoning it back up, I placed a small Allen key into the end of the detent shaft to check if it was tight. It was not...

So I removed the shaft, the large spring, the spring cup and the two washers. As you'll see in the pictures, the detent shaft has two distinct grooves worn into it from the ball bearings. I cleaned everything thoroughly, treated the detent shaft to a wire wheel cleaning, and reassembled. I placed some blue Loctite on the detent shaft threads and snugged it into place.

Finally, I fitted another shim behind each detent spring. The action is very positive now, with no hint of popping out. Unfortunately the grooves I found mean that at some point I'll need to 'spring' for the rebuild kit, as these will only deepen, and the springs will continue to fatigue with age & use.






















Andreas

 

I think this was already proposed, but perhaps not completely explained. Is there anyway to rotate the shaft 90° so that the two sprung ball bearings are not running in the tracks they have worn, but rather on fresh shaft surface? Maybe by adding a spacer shim to the shaft to take up a quarter turn when re-tightening it. Seems like there would still be enough head room in the casing, but I'm not seeing it as clearly as you are.

 

That makes perfect sense and I may do just that in the future if/when the action changes again.

For now, the joystick solidly clicks into float and stays there.




Andreas

 

I was having this same issue on my X748. Pulled apart and cleaned and inspected three different times. No noticeable wear (albeit slight corrosion). I finally sprung for the kit and put it in. No issues now, she works like a champ. Its nice to not have to worry about it.

 

Wow NLA on the JD site! Have you tried NAPA?

 

AM132338 still available at my dealer for $111. A little cheaper if you search on-line. Here is what I believe looks like.

 

That looks identical to the kit I used. I cant believe the difference it made.

 

I ordered the kit (AM132338) yesterday, will be here on Tuesday.

 

Would you please post back with any kinks in installation procedure... I'm negotiating with Santa to bring me one as well :tango_face_smile:

 

Mine came the other day for the 455, Hope to tackle it next week. Now the one on the 425 is popping out...grrr...

At least I'll get to practice on the 455 first.

 

At how many hours do these start failing?

 

Hours aren't a constant by any means. Mine only has 380 hours and it failed. Others have many hundreds more hours and no issues.

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