Yes, you can do whatever you want in terms of modifying the fuel filtration system, Just use an in-line filter that's rated for a 4 to 5 psi fuel pump, not one that's made for a gravity fed system or a high pressure fuel injection system. The fact that you've been running without the screen on top of the shutoff valve in the tank could have contributed to your problem, but there should be another screen in the top of the fuel pump (that may be clogged up and be the cause of your problems).

 

Thanks for the tip. Just to be clear, you're advising not to use a gravity type filter, even though it's going to be installed in the line just below the fuel tank and ahead of the fuel pump, right?

Dick Schmidt

 

Filters designed for gravity systems aren't necessarily designed to handle even a few psi that the mechanical fuel pump on the tractor will supply. The paper element on them is designed to allow free flow to supply enough fuel without a pump, and the extra pressure from the pump might cause the filter element to rupture, especially when the filter has accumulated some dirt over time. Some filters designed for gravity systems might do just fine, but I wouldn't use one myself. You should be able to find an inline filter at an auto parts store that's designed for a mechanical pump. Just ask for one for a mid to late 60's car with a carburetor.

 

Thanks again for the good steer. It's off to parts stores tomorrow.

I need this thing running soon because we can be up to our knees in snow at any time now and the tractor is the only plowing device we have for 300' of driveway.

DS

 

I would retain the original fuel filter system. The glass bowl allows you to see the condition of the fuel and the original filter system has performed well for over 30 years.

 

Make sure you've covered "ALL" of the filters on your tractor's fuel system. Check in a manual to be sure you've found them all. My Ford 2000 3 cyl. gas had the same problem. I cleaned the bottom of the tank, checked and cleaned the filters, and then rebuilt the carb. I thought I had the problem solved and after all that it did the same thing. Come to find out, the fuel shut off valve has a clip that holds the inner valve in the body. I removed the clip and opened up the valve and it came out of the valve body, and there was a cylinder shaped screen filter behind all of that. It was about as plugged as it could get. See if you have something similar on your machine. Good luck!
Duane

 

Thanks, Duane.

I think I'm going to try to replace the original in-tank filter (if it can be done without removing the tank). The bottom of the gas tank is very clean looking. When adding fuel I'm real fussy about not allowing contaminants to get into the tank.

Dick Schmidt

 

The in-tank filter is an integral part of the fuel shut-off valve, and yes, you can remove the shut-off valve without removing the tank, but you do need to drain the tank. If the nylon screen filter has come off of the shut-off valve, then you may need to replace the entire shut-off valve assembly. As I stated earlier, there should be another screen behind a cover plate on the top of the fuel pump as well.

 

Well, I'm back to square one. I had the carb cleaned and rebuilt by pro's. I installed a good quality in line fuel filter. The tractor started quickly and ran perfectly for about 20 minutes, then died when I asked for some work using the bucket loader. It restarted (with choke) and ran fine for another 10-15 minutes, then stopped again. That time, no firing at all when trying to restart. I let it sit for an hour and it started right away but as soon as the temperature guage got up to the bottom of the red (normal running temp since I've owned it) it died when I used hydraulics and wouldn't restart until another cool down. I tried two more test periods with the same results. Today I'm going to let it run at high idle with no use of hydraulics and see what happens. I believe it'll idle all day without quitting until you put it under a load.

It sure seems like it's temperature related. Do you lean toward a fuel problem or electrical? The unit has the original coil. I changed points, condenser, plugs, and plug wires about 10 years ago. Since then, the tractor has been used less than 50 hrs per year.

 

sounds like ignition coil to me. But does it normally require choking to restart? That's the symptom that makes it sounds like a fuel issue.

 

Thanks. It does require choking to restart after cool down but it always has since I bought it. Once it's up to running temperature and dies, it doesn't fire at all when cranking with full choke.

I'll go ahead and replace the coil. I have to say that when the thing quits, the coil feels only slightly warm - not hot at all.

Dick Schmidt

 

Seems like I was always swapping coils or cleaning up the points on my 860. I finally got sick of it and put a new electronic ignition in it.

 

Thanks. Did your problems happen after the tractor was warmed up? This thing runs nicely when it's relatively cool.

DS

 

The updraft carb design on the 3 cylinder Ford thousand series definitely requires choking to start when cold through cool, and even partial choking to start into the warm range. My 4000 will start on no choke only shortly after shut down at full operating temperature. In most situations above cool though, you must push the choke knob back in almost immediately, or the engine will stall from being over choked.

Your symptoms sound like you either have a non-vented gas cap, or the vent is clogged. Try running with the gas cap off to see if it'll run more than 15 to 20 minutes.

 

Dick,
Looking over this whole post, I noticed you said you changed plugs, points, and condenser about 10 years ago. Even if you haven't used the tractor much, it's definitely time to do those again. It's very cheap and would be a shame if all of your aggravation was because of plugs, points, or condenser.
I was having trouble with my 860 last month. Very hard starting and sometimes wouldn't fire at all. I only use it about 10 hours a year. I'd done a tune up in the spring of '09 and thought that couldn't be it. After replacing P,P, and C, it starts and runs just fine.
Good luck and please keep us posted! Happy Thanksgiving, too!
Duane

 

Thanks for more input. This AM I started the unit and let it run at high idle for 25 minutes when the temp was just shy of red. I then put the tractor through similar tasks that I was doing the other day when it quit. It didn't miss a beat. The outside temperature today was almost 30 degrees cooler than when the problem occurred, whatever that may mean.

I should be happy but I'm certain the next time it acts up, I'll be up to the tractor's seat in snow drifts.

After reading your note I went out and checked the vented gas cap. I can easily blow mouth air into the 4 small holes on it and little anti surge ball inside the cap is free to move around.

How challenging is it to remove the fuel pump. I understand there's another screen/filter there that could be partially clogged.

DS

 

Dick,
If the fuel pump on your 4000 is the same as my gas 2000 3 cyl., you don't have to take the fuel pump off to clean the screen. Part of the pump cover comes off to gain access to the screen. I think you should pick up a tech. manual for your tractor, too. Then you can be sure you've checked every screen and filter in your fuel system. It seems all of these tractor models are different than the others. The manual is really helpful. Look on Ebay or at Tractor Supply store if you have one near you. Again, good luck and keep us posted.
Duane

 

Thank you, Duane. Points, plugs, and condensor are the next purchase. I remember filing points in my older cars to make them last longer - how cheap is that? I didn't grow up during the depression but I inherited the habits of those that did. Gets in the way sometimes.
DS

 

Thanks, Curtis. We kept the glass sediment bowl in place but unfortunately, the nut used to tighten the glass against the gasket is corroded beyond help. I had it off and even a 2 day soak in WD-40 didn't loosen it. Now we've got a very slight leak - nothing major.

DS

 

That sounds easy to me. At least I can assure myself that garbage isn't hanging out in the only filter/screen remaining that I haven't checked. The small brass screen at the carb inlet had lots of little "chunks" in it the day I pulled the carb off.

DS

 

Dick,
I, too, was a points filer. I don't think I ever put new points in my '62 Corvair. One major lesson I learned from my good ole Uncle George is worth sharing. I'd tuned up my dad's '64 Olds and it wouldn't run worth crap. Spitting and backfiring. My uncle came over and put the old parts back in one at a time until it ran right. Turned out the new condenser was bad. Lesson learned. I've used that one a few times over the years.
Duane