What's the best way to fix this problem?

Mike

With your checkbook. Buy a new seat is the best way I'm aware of.

 

Can't believe it's been almost 3 years since I started this thread about my seat...

As I noted in this other thread, my seat completely separated last year...

Seat Adhesive

I had my garage queen X540 parked outside for a month or so with the snow blower on it. I always lean the seat forward to keep rain off of it. One day I came out and the seat back was hanging. It looked like it just had a bead of silicon shot around it. The next day it fell off. The next day the...

www.mytractorforum.com

Dealing with a separated seat is getting REALLY old (especially in winter, having to clear snow off the tractor to use it to move firewood), and it's too cold to use glue on it now. So...



New seats for this tractor are available, but are $214 from Sears. And of course, if this one separated, why wouldn't a new one do the same?

So, I removed the old seat pan, and looked at new seats at the TSC website. Of course, none match the bottom of mine (this has molded areas for hardware that allows it to be adjusted fore/aft)...

But, I figure I can make something work. Unable to decide which one to buy, I was clicking through a few, and found one on Clearance at a store near me (last one in stock). Normal price $180, Clearance was only $45!!!

This is going to take a bunch of finagling to make it fit and keep the adjustability feature, but I never move it, so I may just bolt it to the pan in a fixed position and declare victory...

Will post updates and pics as I work on getting it mounted later this week.

Mike

 

I would think some adhesive should be available that would remedy that. Maybe this: https://www.3m.com/3M/en_US/company...cts/~/3M-Headliner-Fabric-Adhesive/?N=5002385+8710676+8710693+3292639006&rt=rud

3M has all kinds of adhesives so that is where I'd start looking.

 

Thanks, I was figuring some sort of adhesive, was hoping someone here had done this successfully and could tell me exactly what works.

Looking inside, the cushioning is foam, formed against the inside of the frame. It almost looks like they sprayed it, then connected the two parts to let it cure. I suppose that could just be the way the foam looks after being pressed against the frame for all these years.

I might try rubber cement if no one has a better idea.

Mike

 

If you go to an auto parts store, you may find 'seat and trim' adhesive. Most are a type that you spray onto the surfaces to be joined, and allow to dry for a few minutes. You the press the parts together(you get one chance go get it right) and they stick. The word just popped up, 'contact cement' (glue/adhesive/?). 3M makes it along with several others.
When I have used it, sometimes it comes out of the nozzle like strings of snot(sorry) and other times(brands?) actually forms a 'spray pattern' similar to rattle cans of spray paint.
I would suggest doing some 'debriding' of the cushion material to remove caked/hardened/stiff cushion material and exposing 'fresh' to get a surface that will conform and adhere. I'd not want to chance new adhesive sticking to old crusty adhesive. I'd do the same to the seat 'frame', using a wire brush, hand or drill operated, to remove what comes off easily. Then spray the two surfaces and allow to 'set up'.
Before doing the spray, I would try to figure out a good way to 'lay' the two things together so they line up (end fitment) the way I want. Such tactics as positioning the leading edge of the seat bottom cushion area to the leading edge of the hard shell, and then 'rolling' the rest of the cushion in place. If that resulted in the cushion laying flat and proper, then do the spray and take the plunge. What's the worst that could happen? Some dimples, dents or creases in the foam. Okay. Big deal.
Northern has new seats, Tractor Supply also, and I'd bet there are others local, as do a lot of web based retailers.
The adhesive is about the cost of 3-4 cans of spray paint, FWIW. Not cheap, and you do want to invert and clear the nozzle if you think you may have further use down the road.(some may indicate clearing is not necessary as designs change, FWIW)
I have used it recently on fabric adhered to the door panel of my spouse car. It was not as neat as I'd like as the fabric stretched when I smoothed it in place, leaving excess that needed trimming. I tried it on a headliner, but was not too happy with the results, but it was better than having it droop.
tom

 

For that I would use Weldwood contact cement... Probably rough up the hard portion of the seat back with some 60 grit sandpaper first. Coat both surfaces and let it tack before putting it together... Like above, it's a one shot deal, make sure you have an assembly plan that works. Dry fit it a few times before applying the glue because once you start assembling with the glue there you won't be able to shift it around.

 

Thanks guys!

When I said "rubber cement" above, I was referring to contact cement. I haven't tried the spray, but have used the brush-on method.

I know that it's weatherproof and waterproof, as we use it to glue carpet to aluminum on boats, and it lasts for years.

Great tip on having patience and test-fitting. You aren't kidding about only getting one shot at it.

Will try to update this when I get it done. Several other priorities lined up first.

Mike

 

This is what I would use. https://www.autozone.com/sealants-glues-adhesives-and-tape/headliner-adhesive/no-touch-permatex-body-shop-heavy-duty-headliner-and-carpet-adhesive/130215_0_0 Specifically lists bonding foam on the label. The contact cement that I am used to might melt the foam(?).

 

Interesting... My problem is a little different, but I was thinking along those lines.

The new seat has a flat bottom. The tractor has a flat plate that mounts to a bracket (to act as a hinge so you can flip it forward during storage or refueling if you prefer).

So, I can easily mount the seat directly to the plate with no need for added materials. But, I'd lose the fore/aft adjustability, which is accomplished by a combination of design features of the seat base and the flat plate.

It may be tough to tell from the pics, but there are three plastic slides protruding from the bottom of the molded seat base, those slide in the long slots in the steel base.

There's also a steel lever (with a spring between it and the seat), mounted into a recess in the molded seat base, which engages the series of small holes in the steel plate, to hold the seat in the desired position. In Pic 5, there's a screwdriver blade resting on that lever on the right side of the pic.

Nice, simple design until you realize that they had to use a molded seat base with protrusions and recesses in strategic places...

I should be able to fake this with a piece of (something), just need to figure out how much depth I need to make up.

I also just realized that I forgot to take a pic of the bottom of the seat base after I removed it from the plate...

Mike

...edited to get all the photos in the same orientation, and added the official diagram...

 

Here are some pics showing the details of the bottom of the stock (Craftsman) molded plastic seat base when removed from the steel base plate.

The first and last pics are the same, except for the yellow highlighted area, which is roughly the area I'd need to replicate (yes, it can be a square or rectangle) with a spacer, which would need to be as thick as the area between #1 and #2 on Pic 6 (with red arrows). Then I would cut a slot in the new seat base for the adjuster lever (red arrow 3).

I think I can replicate the 3 square sliders with some bushings.

I will also need to figure out a safety (operator presence) switch setup.

Mike

 

I bought a piece of oak board trim tonight, wasn't willing to shell out huge money for a piece of 1/2-inch plywood.

The piece I bought was $10, which seems reasonable for my experiment. If it works out, I'll think about finding a 1/2-inch thick piece of plastic or steel to make a more weather-resistant spacer.

Mike

 

I bought a piece of oak board trim tonight, wasn't willing to shell out huge money for a piece of 1/2-inch plywood.

The piece I bought was $10, which seems reasonable for my experiment. If it works out, I'll think about finding a 1/2-inch thick piece of plastic or steel to make a more weather-resistant spacer.

Mike

$1 Resale shop cutting board for the 1/2" plastic. I just built wheel spacers out of one.

 

Why didn't I think of that??? That's 1000% what I need!

Mike

 

Ya that cutting board plastic is VARY handy for a lot of things. Its cheap, and cuts easy. You cant paint it though, and it always looks like it looks... but it will be around LONG after we are all dead and gone!

 

Yep. Wife picked up another one for me the other day for a buck just to have on hand. I band sawed the outside of that one and jigsawed the inside fairly easily.

 

Our local Salvation Army store closed years ago, so we don't have thrift stores nearby. I looked at the Dollar Tree today, but they had none. Next best thing was Job Lot, I grabbed one for $6.

Mike

 

Some days I overthink these things...

After trying two local stores to find bushings to make this work per the original design (and failing, of course), I'm just going to copy the setup on my Husqy GTH2548, which uses a set of rails.

I ordered this, should arrive by March 1. I should be able to mount it directly to the seat base:

Amazon.com: Seat Slide Rails Compatible with John Deere 70 4320 4520 2520 4400 3120 240 320 Case 420 450 430 Bobcat 773 Gehl Komatsu Mustang Daewoo Case IH Caterpillar New Holland Massey Ferguson JCB Montana: Garden & Outdoor

As much as I was looking forward to cutting up the cutting board, I don't really want to deal with trying to Mickey Mouse around with trying to cut and modify bushings or spacers to make this work.

Mike

 

Some days I overthink these things...

After trying two local stores to find bushings to make this work per the original design (and failing, of course), I'm just going to copy the setup on my Husqy GTH2548, which uses a set of rails.

I ordered this, should arrive by March 1. I should be able to mount it directly to the seat base:

Amazon.com: Seat Slide Rails Compatible with John Deere 70 4320 4520 2520 4400 3120 240 320 Case 420 450 430 Bobcat 773 Gehl Komatsu Mustang Daewoo Case IH Caterpillar New Holland Massey Ferguson JCB Montana: Garden & Outdoor

As much as I was looking forward to cutting up the cutting board, I don't really want to deal with trying to Mickey Mouse around with trying to cut and modify bushings or spacers to make this work.

Mike

That'll be better anyways as it'll make it easier to adjust if the kiddos need to use it.

 

Right. The original seat on the Craftsman GS6500 was also adjustable, but half of the mechanism needed was molded into the seat pan. Tough to replicate quickly.

Here are some pics of the Husqy. It also has a much simpler safety switch setup than the GS6500. I may be able to salvage something off the old GT5000 to help here.

Mike

 

Wash thoroughly with thinners
Apply sikaflex put some sort of sports balls in the seat and clamp down to the bottom &* back.
If that is too difficult you can do the bottom first then the back

 

Wash thoroughly with thinners
Apply sikaflex put some sort of sports balls in the seat and clamp down to the bottom &* back.
If that is too difficult you can do the bottom first then the back

The sikaflex seems like a good option at it's priced reasonable and comes in different colors. Says it drys fast and it rated for outdoor use.

I've used shoe goo but the price is costly. I use clamps similar to the ones in the picture when using shoes goo. If the seat is black I just let it squeeze out into a bead. I sometime then install a seat cover to help extend the life and keep water out

On the seats that have the drain hole at the rear of the seat, to secure the bottom I just use a piece of nylon strapping tied through the hole to secure the bottom of the seat when the back is still attached.

 

My wife originally said that the slide rail kit would arrive by March 1. Apparently, she meant to say between Feb 24 and Mar 1.

Edit: UPS just delivered it!

Mike

 

Well, good news and bad news...

The good news is, the slide rails will mount perfectly to the new seat with four of the existing, pre-tapped holes!

The bad news is, it's not quite that simple...

Due to the width of the base plate (that attaches to the tractor to act as a hinge), I need to use the inner set of holes (8 inches apart, shown with the yellow arrows in Pic 1 below) in the new seat base. These are inside of the molded recess for the adjuster lever (molded into the seat base), so I'll need to add some spacers (thick fender washers should suffice) between the rails and seat. That's the minor problem.

The bigger problem is that the studs on the slide rails, when installed to align with the 8-inch seat hole spacing, need an 8x11 inch hole pattern to be drilled into the tractor hinge/base plate.

In the pics below, the pink paper is 8×11 exactly, so that will help me determine where I can put hole centers in the hinge plate. Due to the long slots (used for the slide on the original seat), I really can only get two full holes near the rear of the hinge plate (wide end at the top of the pics).

The holes that I'll need at the front of the hinge plate (narrow end) will overlap with the outer edges of those slots (see yellow arrows in Pic 4). At a minimum, this will be difficult to drill, but I'm more concerned about how tight/stable I'll be about to make this.

May end up needing that cutting board as an adapter plate after all...

Also: Extra holes. I'm going to need to fill all of those unused holes in the new seat base with some sort of sealant, to keep water out when not in use.

Mike

 

Wish I was there Mike. So hard to brainstorm without the workpiece in my hands.

 

New idea this morning...

Seems pretty obvious that I'll need some backing material for the front holes (narrow end). Due to the ridges in the plate, I won't be able to use a solid piece all the way across.

BUT, I can cut two pieces of that cutting board to form a pair of wedges (hopefully to be a tight fit in the space), which I can run the studs through.

The two white outlines in the pic below would be the spacers, the four red dots are roughly where the bolts would go.

EDIT: Looking at it closely, I'm going to have to remove the small metal piece at the end of the left slot. I believe that's just a stop for the original seat/slide. Pic 2 shows where this will interfere with the stud for the new slide.

Mike

 

Got the new seat mounted today. Not "easy," but much easier than I'd expected...

Just realized that I forgot to fill the extra screw holes...

EDIT: Pic of seat box added...

Mike

 

contact cement and 2 boards followed by 2 bar clamps. Painters tape to make sure it did not ooze out around the seat.

 

Looks good, let us know how that lasts over time!

My replacement seat still looks new (after a year and a half).

Mike

 

Why buy a new seat when it's so easy to repair the old seat? Mountains of unnecessary new trash are produced every year due to so many people being ignorant of how to make a common sense repair. The only tool they own is a single screwdriver they can't find, and sometimes a hammer they remember seeing a few years ago. It's also due to laziness and a fear of getting a bit of dirt on their hands, and it's seems easier to just go buy a new product in a nice clean box. Doesn't really matter because it's those type of people rarely cut their own grass.