New EE170 owner -- looking for help bypassing some safety functions

Sorry, but I’m going to have to stop any discussion of your point #1 right here. Discussing how to bypass safety devices is strictly against the house rules here at MTF.

Tread lightly around #2, please, as I’d hate to have to lock or delete this thread.

Thanks for your consideration!


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Re: New EE170 owner -- looking for help bypassing some safety functions

Sorry, but I’m going to have to stop any discussion of your point #1 right here. Discussing how to bypass safety devices is strictly against the house rules here at MTF.

Tread lightly around #2, please, as I’d hate to have to lock or delete this thread.

Thanks for your consideration!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Got it, thanks for your input. If I could get some advice with issue 2 then I could live with issue 1 (I wish I had researched this, as brand new Craftsman mowers do still allow to freely mow in reverse without having to hold down a switch each time.)

 

#1, same issue I noticed between my Craftsman and Deere. On my Craftsman, I can turn the keyswitch one position, then push a button. A red LED comes on to signify Reverse Mowing Mode and it will stay that way until I turn it off. On the Deere, I have to lift the flippin' lever each time I want to back up.

#2, check to see if the switch can be adjusted to be less sensitive for your body weight. If you ever come out of the seat when you don't plan on it, you'll understand why the switch has to be there. I do a WHOLE lots of leanin' while mowing on both machines, so I get your drift. I call it Body English, same as you'd do on a bike or motorcycle. I can lean quite a ways without triggering the switch though.

 

The Craftman models certainly seem to be a lot more user-friendly to actually mowing. They have the same safety features as the JD, but implemented in a way that doesn't hamper the main purpose of the mower.

At this point I'm honestly debating returning the JD E170 and getting another Craftsman...

 

Issue 2) The dead man switch on the E170 is a bazillion times more sensitive than on my LT2000
I mentioned earlier that my yard is challenging. Steep hills that I both go up and down and also traverse. While traversing a hill on my LT2000, I would literally hang of the upside of the tractor the way a sailor hangs off the top of a tilted catamaran. I'd also shift my weight over whichever rear wheel had the most grip while going up hills. I can't do this on my new E170 since the dead man switch always cuts off the blades which literally makes the E170 useless on a good portion of my yard. The dead man switch on my LT2000 would only disengage if my butt came completely off the seat.

Any mods to make the deadman switch on the E170 cover the entire seat like my LT2000? Or, worst case scenario, any way to disable it?

This is a tough one and I share your pain. My JD X500 seat switch is also very sensitive but it has some sort of delay circuit built into it that enables you to unweight a butt cheek for a second or so before the engine starts to shut off. So if you are quick to get your cheek back down when the engine starts to die you can usually save it. Most times I can save it but sometimes I can not.

My 2720 compact tractor is even worse. All you have to do is unweight a butt cheek while turning around to look behind you while reversing (i.e. you know, backing up in a safe manner) and the engine will instantly shut down. The shutdown is instant and there is no saving it. This can lead to some dangerous situations because when the engine stops you also lose your steering.

The issues are even worse in cold weather when the vinyl of the seats becomes a tad stiffer and even more difficult to depress.

I think the only real solution is to eat more Twinkies and get your weight up enough to keep that switch mashed under all conditions.

 

For #2, can you see how the seat safety switch operates? If it's something like a spring-loaded switch under the seat, perhaps you could do something like swap out the spring to one that will stay actuated with less weight on the seat?

My Craftsman is 20 years old, and has no RIO at all, but the seat deadman switch is pretty forgiving. So I've never given that stuff any thought.

Before returning the E170 for a Craftsman, I'd do some research and just make sure that the Craftman machines aren't the same as the Deeres now.

 

Thanks, I did check and Craftsman models still have it where you you can freely mow in reverse when you twist the ignition one notch to the left. But they now include a light that stays lit on the dashboard to remind you that you are in that mode. Now THAT'S how it should be implemented on JD models.

As for the dead man's switch, on my Craftsman, it was almost like the switch was activated by a bar that went across the whole seat -- so it your butt was on any part of the seat it would be OK. On the JD, it seems like your weight must be firmly planted in the center of the seat.

I had my Craftsman for almost 14 years with no problems. I think to myself if I could live with this JD E170 for the next 14 years and I just can't do that.

 

Hum, I thought the RIO system was like a "set it once and forget" type operation through out a mowing session until it is manually turned off.

 

Nope.

Every. Single. Time.

At least that's how it works on my E170.

 

Remember you have the John Deere promise. Thoroughly evaluate the whole machine, and then make your decision. Steve

 

Don't you just love these safety features on these new machines. And people wonder why I have a tractor that's 18 years old. I cut half my yard in reverse.

 

If you think Rio is a pain just wait till they put blade cut offs for slopes (with butt still in seat) and engine kill for hills that are too steep.

 

Who buys tractors with these worthless devices? To many I guess, they are still selling them.

 

Is this what your Craftsman LT2000 looks like? Is it gear drive? If so, it looks identical to my old Ariens 17.5 HP.

 

Yup! That was it.

 

Is the E170 suppose to be mowing slopes or just level ground, don't know the models anymore ??

What do you mean whrer are there any other brands ?? There are other companies right @ Lowes and HD ( ie Husky ) plus Cub @ TSC along with Craftsmen @ Sears.

 

Is the E170 suppose to be mowing slopes or just level ground, don't know the models anymore ??

All the E-series mowers are capable of mowing on both flat and sloped terrain.

 

I would look on craigslist for a craftsman that doesn't have those safety features. I'm sure you can find a craftsman for 2 or 3 hundred. If it last a few years, just buy another one. Your ahead than spending on a new one with all the safety stuff. Chances are it's going to get worst with more safety stuff the're putting on the new ones.

 

He might as well just buy a MTD Gold 20HP for $1399 since MTD is who makes most of the other brands anyway. Less parts issues as well as you just go to MTD for parts.

And you are right... the newer the tractor the more "safety" features it is likely to have and I'm sure even more are on the way. So you can either keep buying old clunkers to try to avoid the safety stuff or simply buy a decent NEW tractor that meets your needs and do with the extra safety stuff what the rest of us do - DELETE IT.

 

The solution to the RIO is very simple and a little Google search will give you a solution.

You could also use a key switch to replace the button to give you the same RIO as your old Craftsman mower.

Ive chosen to get use to mine as is and just get used to it.

As for the leaning to get traction I totally understand. My old husky couldnt go sideways on a slope unless you leaned to put weight on the uphill tire. My new JD climbs a 30 degree hill like it's not there and I don't have to lean anymore. Only time my seat switch goes off is if I stand up without putting the parking brake on.

Tire weights or chains / Terra grips will help you on you slopes so you don't have to lean as much.

 

So I went back to Lowe's and I can return the tractor any time within 30 days, so that's great.

I went back to Sears and the closest new Craftsman to my old Craftsman is this:
https://www.sears.com/craftsman-255...-stratton-fender/p-A013239076?plpSellerId=Sears&prdNo=2&blockNo=2&blockType=G2#

- It's got a similar key ignition that allows you to freely mow backwards (you only have to press the button once, rather than every time you go in reverse)

- But the seat design is different from my old one in that the dead man's switch is in the middle. So I would potentially still have to modify that. But the Craftsman also sits much lower than the JD E170 so I may not have to lean as much.

- The Craftsman above is also the ONLY model available with Fender Hydro automatic like my old tractor. I like that so much better than having three pedals.

- Lastly, the rear tire sidewalls on the Craftsman are also much larger than the E170 so the ride should be less bumpy.

- I also went to Home Depot to look at Cub Cadet XT1 series (the same company makes both Craftsman and Cub Cadet as they share similar parts like the exact same key ignition system, etc.). Both the Cub Cadet and especially the Craftsman look a lot more cheaply built.

- The JD E170 has 24 HP V-twin, the Craftsman only has a 19 HP single cylinder (my old Craftsman only had an 18.5 HP single cylinder so I could live with it).

So now I have to figure out if I want to keep the (much more powerful and better built) JD E170 and modify the heck out of it, or return it and get the Craftsman.

Decisions, decisions, decisions...

 

- The JD E170 has 24 HP V-twin, the Craftsman only has a 19 HP single cylinder (my old Craftsman only had an 18.5 HP single cylinder so I could live with it).

I'll bet the engine in that Craftsman is a single cylinder Briggs & Stratton. That's the same engine as in my Ariens. They have a known issue with the cam-based compression release system. The little pot-metal mechanism breaks and then the starter doesn't have enough power to crank the engine. Had to replace my cam with only 25 hrs or so on the engine.

 

For the ride, maybe try letting some air out of the tires, and see if that helps? You could also maybe try different springs under the seat or something, but that's more involved.

 

For the ride, maybe try letting some air out of the tires, and see if that helps? You could also maybe try different springs under the seat or something, but that's more involved.

I'll bet that a motivated person could reduce the intrusiveness of the safety switches without a lot of fuss. Personally, I wouldn't be thrilled about going with worse build quality, just to avoid some safety interlocks. Usability annoyances can probably be improved, but build quality is tough to change.

This is so true.

I'll check the tire pressure as well and adjust if needed. I'll post here to give my impressions if the mowing experience has improved.

 

I would never go to a Craftsman or Cub over what you got at a **** of a deal. Your issues are overall petty and with a little research can easily be overcame. Don't do it..

 

Petty is relative. But not when it means it will would take at least an hour longer each time to mow the lawn because I'd have to use a push mower on hills and areas that I used to be able to mow with my Craftsman.

 

What about the war veterans that lost their left arm? How are they going to press the yellow button with their right hand, steer at the same time to back up and mow?

 

You would be amazed at the Prosthetic limbs they make today where a Button or a switch would be easy for them to manipulate . I have friend currently still serving in the Army who lost his Hand to a Grenade. He wouldn't Have a Problem with the reverse safety switch. BTW he owns a JD S240 currently :thThumbsU

 

Just maybe the "seat system" off of the old craftsman, can be installed on the Deere.

 

He listed too many better points on the Craftsman. Some people are not JD people. I STILL think he should go with the Craftsman.

BTW the JD site did NOT show the E170 for hills and slopes if I read it right.AND IF the K46 should die he will be even more anti JD Take the 30 day.

 

One old saying I've heard may apply here. If you've had good luck with tires from Sears, buy your tires at Sears.

 

I just now looked up your Deere on tractordata. You have an UNserviceable, who knows what brand hydrostat. This is not a many year tractor, but truly a lowes/home depot mower. I'd say that what you paid for it is fair market value and the 2400 sticker price is OVERpriced. The Craftsman is looking better to me. However, if you could find a used LX178 for about $1000, you could pocket the $700! Then you'd have a forever mower.

 

I'm not sure what transaxle is in the E170. But do you know which one is in the Craftsman? Can the fluid be changed in that one?

I'm not trying to sound rude or anything, I just don't know what info you have on the Craftsman, that shows the tranny in that one to be a better solution.

I agree that a good used machine could probably offer a more robust tractor, for less money. But I recognize that not everyone wants to deal with used, or maybe you need something now, and can't wait a month to find a good used machine.

 

What happened to the old Craftsman? Will 1700 make it like new again?

 

That's just more "box-store model" bashing.
If you look at the source at deere.com instead of the second-hand info at tractordata.com, you'd quickly find that the E170 has a TuffTorq K46AC.
https://www.deere.com/en/mowers/lawn-tractors/100-series/e170-lawn-tractor/

New riding lawn mowers under $3,000 all have very similar capabilities for a given price, and none are made for huge mowing tasks (acres), ground-engaging tasks, or moving up/down slopes regularly. I'd argue that the Deere 100-series mowers are some of the best in that price category. If you use them for the tasks they're designed for, there's no reason those models can't last for many years.

You have to put things in perspective... many of the older models discussed a lot on this forum are functionally equivalent to today's new X500 or X700 tractors.

Agree with above - not everybody has the time or desire to buy used and take on any required mechanical work that may go along with a used tractor. You certainly need to pick out the correct new mower/tractor for your intended use, and granted, some people might honestly need an X500/X700, but a lot of people don't and will be perfectly happy with less-expensive models.

 

He should just keep the tractor and make the alterations. I guess it's very simple.

 

I'm on the "get a craftsman" band wagon.

Sounds like the items you mention are not going to be resolved as easily. For example the fender lever for forward/reverse.