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Discussion starter · #24 ·
Hello
The winter storm has Passed us, so today I will be getting this 316 in my shop to see if we can get the Onan engine up & running. My son in law is coming to help me this AM with it. Regards, Hammerdown
 
Discussion starter · #27 ·
Hello
Stage one of this Project took Place this AM. My Son in law helped me today and we pushed the 316 into my shop. We removed the floor pan, Hood, Grill, & Grill support's. We Then traced down some issues in the wiring harness and Placed a battery. I used an external Gas can as I have not cleaned the gas Tank Yet as our concern was whether or Not the Onan ran good. I gave it a Good shot of Either and it roared to Life. It did not smoke or have any funny Noises it sounded Healthy and trouble free so we have a great engine and I now Think it may be just a 349.4 Hour machine. It warmed up and was charging the battery and running Great, But I Plan on cleaning the Carburetor on it as we had to run it half choke to keep it running good. We are going to Look at the John Deere 317 tomorrow to weight out if it would be worth Placing the Onan in that tractor or repairing the 316 that it is In Now. I was Very Pleased to hear how Great the P-218 Ran, we Got a Good engine here. Regards, Hammerdown
 
Nice :fing32: always good when things work out.
 
Even it had a hard life these machines can be brought back to like new,the working parts dont deterioate like the body parts do,I say go for it and leave the 317 for someo else.
 
I vote...bring it back to life. Well, with a 318 frame, power steering, locking rear.....oh wait :eek:

I think a good strip down and repaint can get that back to a good state. Its not like you are in the middle of the road with its condition.

Sent from my DROID RAZR HD
 
Depending on the shape of the 317 i say save the 316, for a few reasons

If the hour meter does work and since the motor only has 430 hours or whatever low number it has, the transmission would also as long as the rest of the compenents.

Also, your rebuilt your 318 top to bottom so the 316 should be a cakewalk, the 317 may have some differences and what not.

Another point i thought is the attachments. If your son needed a tiller or blade at short notice the one from your 318 would fit no problem until he found one, but a 317 would be starting fresh on attachments.

Well just my thoughts anyway. Plus doesnt the 318 and 316 share electrical components so if later you have to diagnose a problem you could switch and swap instead of trying to "guestimate" the problem

Keep up your awsome work :)


Mikey.
 
subscribed! cannot believe i missed it. good score Hammer!
 
Discussion starter · #36 ·
Knowing you Hammer by the time your done with it you will have that tractor like new.
Even it had a hard life these machines can be brought back to like new,the working parts dont deterioate like the body parts do,I say go for it and leave the 317 for someo else.
Hello Guy's
The worse part of this 316 is the floor pan. There are no 316 or 318 floor pan's in my area or other body Part's for that matter. I can straighten out the floor pan but it would be a lot of work it is smashed badly on the rear portion. The side engine cover's are decent one still has most of it's paint but the other one is rusty as well as the steering column pedastil sheet metal. All of the sheet metal is repairable but majoy body work will need to be done to it. The 317 is an H-2 Tractor with a flow diverter Valve mounted on the right side pedastil cover. The body on the 317 is very nice and would require little work to Paint and make look nioce. I think I can get the 317 for $100.00 or less as my Buddy Bought it for the mwoing deck and we have a 50" deck to use with this 316. We will be checking out the 317 today to weigh this all out and decided which Tractor would be the better one to use. As it stand's now we have about $100.00 in the 316 with the cost of $50.00 Buying it and $50.00 in Fuel bringing it home. If we buy the 317 that will Make the Project a $200.00 Tractor as it currently sit's witha Blown Kohler K-17 in it. I figure Paint & Supplies, Gas hose, Mini clamps,oIl and engine filter, Hydraulic filter and one quart to top it off the Hydro Transmission should put us at about $250.00 in the 316 or $350.00 in the 317 total here...Hammerdown
 
Hammer I'm very pleased to hear that it pop'd and fired right up to life w/a little either :fing32:

It's always nice when life threats you nice with easy jobs like this. I'm sending you a PM for a link to something that may help make the 316 to 317 a little bit easier ;)

I for one don't mind what others think about keeping the 316 or making a 317 but am all about what works out best for you in the end.

From what I'm seeing and thinking the 317 would definitely be the better option base on the H2, Better Fender Pan and over all looks, ease of getting a tiller, 3pth and other attachments that already fit the front of your 318. You already know that any thing that fits the front of the 318 will fit the 317 and the 317 has easier attachments like the 33 tiller that will also work on a 140 H3 if that ever tickles your fancy ;)... I know it does mine :fing32:

I got a lot done today including chasing down the electrical problem that was preventing the engine from charging the battery all because of a bad Ignition switch or key switch.

I'm no expert but I will be by the time I'm done here in a few minutes and if you need any help I'll give you all the help I can with in what I know about the 317 and it's electrical or other systems that may need attention if and once you decide to go that route.

Best of luck to you either way,

N2 Tractors
 
Discussion starter · #38 ·
Hammer I'm very pleased to hear that it pop'd and fired right up to life w/a little either :fing32:

It's always nice when life threats you nice with easy jobs like this. I'm sending you a PM for a link to something that may help make the 316 to 317 a little bit easier ;)

I for one don't mind what others think about keeping the 316 or making a 317 but am all about what works out best for you in the end.

From what I'm seeing and thinking the 317 would definitely be the better option base on the H2, Better Fender Pan and over all looks, ease of getting a tiller, 3pth and other attachments that already fit the front of your 318. You already know that any thing that fits the front of the 318 will fit the 317 and the 317 has easier attachments like the 33 tiller that will also work on a 140 H3 if that ever tickles your fancy ;)... I know it does mine :fing32:

I got a lot done today including chasing down the electrical problem that was preventing the engine from charging the battery all because of a bad Ignition switch or key switch.

I'm no expert but I will be by the time I'm done here in a few minutes and if you need any help I'll give you all the help I can with in what I know about the 317 and it's electrical or other systems that may need attention if and once you decide to go that route.

Best of luck to you either way,

N2 Tractors



Hello Guy's
I am Pondering the thought of Buying that blown up Model 317 to toss this Onan engine in. There are Three reason's mainly here for me doing that being that the 317 has a very nice looking body on it, it would take very little to get it into a New Paint job compared to the body panel's of this 316 that are rusty and beat down and would take me a week to Prepare for paint, Plus I am missing the rear Tail Light assemblies' and one pedestal screen on the right side that I would have to come up with if I use the 316. The 317 is an H-2 Tractor where as the 316 is an H-1 Tractor. The 317 has the Optional Factory heavy duty style Hydraulic Flow diverter that is Mounted on the left steering Pedastal sheet metal, That is a Great Option when using Impliment's. I Now feel Very confident that the 316 is an actual 349.4 Hour Tractor now due to the engine not showing any Oil leaks, and how it started up and Ran so well with No smoke or lifter clatter, I surmise it is a rock solid Low Hour engine. It was hesitant to start, but I feel that it has not been run in a Long time. We Had a Heck of a time getting it to Pump fuel as we used a 2-1/2 Gallon Gas can eliminating the gas tank, as I said I surmise it need's a good flushing and the last thing I wanted to do was to Pump all of the Trash from the gas Tank into The Carburetor.



It Lit Fast on Either, but I am Not a Fan of using a lot of either so I had my son in law Place his hand over the top of the Carburetor as I was cranking over the engine and it did the Trick of waking up the Onan fuel pump by filling the Carburetor as it started and ran on it's own. Once it did start we let it run for about Ten Minute's and it Ran nice but I noticed that it did not want to run smooth Unless I had the choke Pulled Three quarter's of the way on. That told me that the carburetor need's cleaning so that is next on the list at sorting out this engine. I did have an electrical issue that we have not solved yet. It will not start on it's own when the key switch is Turned to The start Position. We found a wire Laying down by the front of the starter when we were going over the wiring harness prior to getting it running. Oddly it is a Blue wire with a female spade terminal on the end of it. The Logical place for it to go would have been on the starter solenoid as it was pre=formed and bent into that area. My son in law hooked it to the Male prong of the solenoid as we felt it had to go there, But the wiring diagram show's that a Blue wire is supposed to go to the front PTO, but in the case of this Tractor it has a two Prong connector feeding the PTO and it work's when the switch is put into on position.



I got it up and running by crossing the male spade's on the rear of the key Ignition switch. Once it fire's up it runs fine on it's own and shut's down by using the key switch so at this Point I surmise that I have a faulty ignition switch. Our Local John Deere dealership was closed yesterday now being on winter hour's so I will have to go there on Monday to get the correct Ignition switch which I feel is the issue at hand of it not wanting to turn the engine over at this time by use of the key switch. Some of the machine's safety switch's have been eliminated being looped by wire. The Neutral safety switch is working and has not been Looped. The seat safety switch has been looped, oddly enough the PTO switch Looked to have had a wire loop Placed in it but the factory wiring diagram shows a factory Loop wire placed in the Rear PTO Portion of the Plug. There is some sort of switch at the right brake pedal I am not sure what this switch is for as my 318 does not have that switch it may be a neutral safety switch, if someone know's different Please let me know here.


Today we will be checking out this Blown up Model 317. if I decide to buy it, there is lot's of work involved as I will have to Transfer the Onan wiring harness into the 317 so that the Onan Transplanted engine will be Plug & Play. I know that the two machines do not have the same motor mount's so I surmise to make the Onan work out in the 317 I will have to cut the Kohler engine mount's out of the 317 frame and Place The Onan engine mount's that will have to be harvested from the 316 and Put into the 317 then welded up. I do Know that John Deere Placed the P-218's in these 317's once the Kohler K-17's exploded but what I am not sure of is how much extra work is involved in doing a Transplant. If someone reading this, has done such a Transplant I sure would like to hear what all is involved here to cut to the chase and save me some time and aggravation. If it is Too Much work we can just stay with the 316 chassis and body and fix what we have to work with at this time. I Plan on selling the Power flow unit as well as the spare Floor Pan that serves no purpose to us to help pay for bringing this 316 back from The Grave here. I do Know that my son in law was very happy to hear this Onan run yesterday and even happier to hear that it is very healthy and will make him and excellent engine. Regards, Hammerdown
 
Hammer it's very easy and no cutting or welding is involved if you use the piece I PM'd you earlier. It's not my ebay item for sale I'd buy it just to have it but my ebay account is not in good standing atm. " don't ask "

In any case I just did this to my Tri Tip 317 Tractor in my sig and it's so easy you would not believe it. NO CUTTING OR WELDING NEEDED . ;)

Seriously the wiring is super easy as well. The only thing is the if the 316 wiring is like the 318 w/the extra time delay crud then you would be much happier w/the 317 any way as it don't require any time delay start thingy's

I'm telling you trust me it's super easy. Just buy the tractor and the plate and your home free.

I pretty much have already done all the work for you in my 317 build thread ;)

Edit: I'll get to work on the Wiring diagram for you as I was not able to find one available. It's super duper easy once you know where every thing goes. I'm trying to keep it all color coded as well which makes it even that much easier for guys like you and who ever wishes to follow suit. :fing32:

N2 Tractors.

Edit #2:

I take that back, I actually did notch out the plate that the motor bolts to that attaches to the frame so that the H2 lines would not rub on the engine plate but other than that I did not have to cut the frame or do any welding. I took a Onan P218G from a 317 and swopped it in to a 317 that had a blown Kohler KT17QS II... It's not hard at all just trust me. You know you want to do it so go ahead and pull the trigger already :thThumbsU

Edit # 3:
The last thing you need to consider is the Starter for the Onan P218G. Since I was coming from a 317 to a 317 the Starter was the correct one. My build thread has the correct starter listed if not there it's in another thread and I can get you a link to the correct starter for the engine so you don't have to cut the frame and jeopardize it's integrity. It sounds like you have welding skills so you may be able to cut away the frame for the starter if need be just be cautious of the H2 lines that run right close to where the starter will be ;)
 
Discussion starter · #40 ·
Hammer it's very easy and no cutting or welding is involved if you use the piece I PM'd you earlier. It's not my ebay item for sale I'd buy it just to have it but my ebay account is not in good standing atm. " don't ask "

In any case I just did this to my Tri Tip 317 Tractor in my sig and it's so easy you would not believe it. NO CUTTING OR WELDING NEEDED . ;)

Seriously the wiring is super easy as well. The only thing is the if the 316 wiring is like the 318 w/the extra time delay crud then you would be much happier w/the 317 any way as it don't require any time delay start thingy's

I'm telling you trust me it's super easy. Just buy the tractor and the plate and your home free.

I pretty much have already done all the work for you in my 317 build thread ;)

Edit: I'll get to work on the Wiring diagram for you as I was not able to find one available. It's super duper easy once you know where every thing goes. I'm trying to keep it all color coded as well which makes it even that much easier for guys like you and who ever wishes to follow suit. :fing32:

N2 Tractors.

Edit #2:

I take that back, I actually did notch out the plate that the motor bolts to that attaches to the frame so that the H2 lines would not rub on the engine plate but other than that I did not have to cut the frame or do any welding. I took a Onan P218G from a 317 and swopped it in to a 317 that had a blown Kohler KT17QS II... It's not hard at all just trust me. You know you want to do it so go ahead and pull the trigger already :thThumbsU

Edit # 3:
The last thing you need to consider is the Starter for the Onan P218G. Since I was coming from a 317 to a 317 the Starter was the correct one. My build thread has the correct starter listed if not there it's in another thread and I can get you a link to the correct starter for the engine so you don't have to cut the frame and jeopardize it's integrity. It sounds like you have welding skills so you may be able to cut away the frame for the starter if need be just be cautious of the H2 lines that run right close to where the starter will be ;)




Hello N2 Tractor's
I fully understand what you are saying here, but in my Case I am trying to Build this John Deere for my son in law at the Lowest Possible cost over all. if we do Pick up the John Deere 317 my Plan's are to gas Torch the Kohler engine mount's off it's frame rail's then take the one's out of the 316 that fit the Onan P-218 and Transfer them over into the 317. At this point and time I have Mixed emotion's of bringing home a two Tractor project as that always' seems to run into Much more cost than Planned you should Know that best here as you are still going through that process.

What I do Know is that we got a Super running P-218 Onan that appear's to be a Low hour engine in a Tractor that has had it's Body panels **** whipped. The Hydro unit checked out good yesterday and it is an Open Frame Tractor of which will readily accept my model 30 Hydraulic tiller. I am not sure if the 317 will accept the use of my model 30 Hydraulic tiller as it is a closed frame Tractor. If we got the 317 I would have to use the wiring Harness out of the 316 for the Onan engine to plug & play. The Only benifit I can see by getting the 317 is having a Tractor that is an H-2 Tractor. In my son in law's case he would not really need an H-2 Tractor unelss he was going to use my Four way 54" dirt dozer blade as he would have no way to Hydro Turn it due to the 316 Only having two hydraulic port's up front.



Most all of the part's on this 316 are exactly the same as what is found on my 318 and I am very familiar with working on a 318 from tearing mine down to the rolling chassis last winter when I restored it. I am Not familiar at all with the working's of a 317 and one thing I fear is at some Point John Deere will cease making part's for them due to their short engine life span. I do know that Most every part is still available for the 316 and the 318 so that is sound judgement selecting a Tractor that we can have for a long time and still get parts for. I will Know more after I look closer at this 317 today but at this Point I am leaning toward's fixing what we have right here. I paid $300.00 for my 1983 ohn Deere 318 about Six Year's ago, so if I can get my son in law into this Tractor done and looking nice for the same price of around $300.00 he would be as Pleased as Punch. he also has a nice 1991 Cub Cadet Model1541 that I found him a Few Years ago. it has a Kohler 18 Horsepower Magnum engine in it and Hydrostatic Transmission. Once I get this John Deere finished he will sell the Cub Cadet and stand's a chance to make at least a $500.00 Profit off of it which would pay for the cost of his new to Him John Deere 316 that I am beringing Back from The Grave. Regards, Hammerdown
 
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