[firenems335]

I have gotten really frustrated lately with the wiring. I have a 12 hp kohler k301aqs i have all the wires hooked up and i can get the starter to turn the motor over but i cant get any spark from my plug i can not figure this out.
do i need a new condensor? anybody know exactly how the ignition coil is wired up?

i am all out of ideas the breaker points looks good but it makes a small tic noise but i can see it working when i turn the motor.

Thanks to all for your answers

 

[mikebramel]

you should see a spark at the points
if there is no spark at the points, make sure there is power at the coil
if there is power at the coil, and there is no spark. i would replace the coil
the points are run to the negative side of the coil, and the condenser is tapped into that circuit.
make sure everything has a good ground

 

[firenems335]

thats a start for me to look at. how would i know if there is power to the coil? i never did see a spark at the points

 

[WNYTractorTinkerer]

thats a start for me to look at. how would i know if there is power to the coil? i never did see a spark at the points

Do you hve a test lite? hook it to a good ground.. test it on the batt. pos.+.. Turn the key to the 'run' position and test the positive terminal of the coil. No positive power= no spark.. If the power is there.. The negative side of the coil hooks to the points/condenser and not to any other thing. Hope this helps.. :goodl:

 

[ErnRemy]

I have been doing some research on ignition systems and here a few good page as to how points system works. I am really thinking about going the route with the Chrysler electronic system to do away with the problems of points wearing out sounds like a easy conversion no more condenser or filing points!
http://gardentractorpullingtips.com/ignition.htm
the first part of this page cover very well how a points condenser system works
http://www.jetav8r.com/Vision/Ignition/CDI.html

 

[mikebramel]

2 ways
1) test light like he said, + part of light at + part of coil with key in RUN/ON position and - part of light to the block or - post on battery if it reaches
2) multimeter set to 20V DC like above

 

[firenems335]

Thanks for all the info, i will get the test light and see what i cant come up with. i thing i am going to get a new coil, condensor, and points because i bellieve it is the original from the 70's.

Since it is a magnet-ignition, how hard is it to convert it to the battery ignition?

I have never done this type of thing before and i am trying to learn and understand which is the fun part of all this.

THank you guys for your input and bits of knowledge you share

 

[ostendorfg]

Years ago automobiles ran with the same point system. They ran for miles with them. In comparison your Kohler is used very little. I understand the newer electronic may be better, however I have used engines with ignition points for years with very little problems. Not very often but a coil or condensor may deteriorate. If the engine sets and is not started I usually find that the points get a film over them. Simply run a small file between them a few times. With the point cover off, while cranking the engine over you should see a spark between the points. If there is no spark, back up to the coil and test it as stated. Still no spark try a new condensor. Still no spark a bad key switch is a possibility. Good luck Gary

 

[firenems335]

Gary,
in reference to the points, is there just that one that is on the side of the engine that the carb is on, It has a half-moon like housing, is this the only "breaker point" that needs to be looked at and see for spark?

 

[ostendorfg]

There is only one set of ignition points. I believe that it is on the side of the engine that the carb is on. However I think the half moon cover you are looking at is the cover over a portion of the gear. The cover over the points is usually about an inch or so wide and about 2 1/2 inches long. There should be a wire coming out of the corner of the cover which goes to the coil. If you don't see it let me know & I'll take a photo of one for you. Gary.........

 

[mikebramel]

Thanks for all the info, i will get the test light and see what i cant come up with. i thing i am going to get a new coil, condensor, and points because i bellieve it is the original from the 70's.

Since it is a magnet-ignition, how hard is it to convert it to the battery ignition?

I have never done this type of thing before and i am trying to learn and understand which is the fun part of all this.

THank you guys for your input and bits of knowledge you share

If you have a magneto ignition now it will not have a coil that you can see outside of the blower cover. There will be no power wires running from the ignition switch to power the coil. The magneto does not need the battery to power it because the action from the magnet on the flywheel generates energy. Because the magneto is self powered the ignition switch grounds the magneto to shut the engine off. I dont think your tractor would have came with magneto ignition. But someone may have added that.

Here is a link to the manual for your engine
http://www.kohlerengines.com/onlinecatalog/pdf/tp_2379.pdf

A battery powered coil is easy to add. Just put a switch on the dash that would run like
(Battery +) -> (Fuse) -> (Switch) -> (12V Ignition coil + side)

This would enable the engine to run and when the engine is running be able to shut it off.

 

[ostendorfg]

It appears you may be a little confused as to the location of the points. If I am incoorect I apologize. Attached is a photo where the ignition points are located. It's under the cover which I attached a piece of masking tape marked with a "P". Hope this helps Gary..............

 

[firenems335]

gary, thank you for the picture and that is correct it looks just like mine. And i looked in the tractor manual and it is a magneto ignition. first and foremost i believe i am going to find every ground and make sure that i have good contact at each. I will get a test light tomorrow and go from there along with looking for a film over the breaker point. I do know that this engine has not been ran two years prior to me getting it because the starter went out so it sat outside in the weather for about two years.

Thank you all for the replies it helps me understand things i didnt. I will have the laptop next to me while i work on this to make sure i do this correctly.
I will let you know how it goes and i hope for the best.

Again, Thanks for the answers
Jake

 

[ostendorfg]

Jake, I am sure you will get it it running. Please note, you will not be able to see a film on the points. If the engine has not ran in two years no doubt that may be all or part of your problem. When you purchase or make your test light, you may also consider a point file and also a spark tester. The spark tester is temp. installed between the spark plug and the spark plug wire. None of these tools should be very expensive. You may have to get the point file from an Auto parts store like Carquest. NAPA etc. good luck Gary....

 

[firenems335]

Gary,
It took five minutes and it was the points. I was able to get it fired right up to my suprise! Now i just need to adjust the carb to make it idle a little better. But it takes next to nothing and she fires right on up!
Thank you for all the help it made a huge difference.
Jake

 

[mikebramel]

sweeet

 

[ostendorfg]

Great glad to hear you have it running. Interested in a few tips with that carb? Before you start adjusting it, first make sure you have the proper amount of oil in the engine. You are going to rev it up pretty good while adjusting the carb. Now is not the time to blow the engine up due to being low on oil. Next if you suspect the fuel is more than about 3 months old, I would drain it & put fresh fuel in it. In addition go to an auto parts store and buy some carb cleaner to add to the fuel. Sea Foam or any carb cleaner will work. If you need help with the adjustments let me know. Gary.............

 

[firenems335]

Thanks for the tip. I had previously changed out the oil a couple weeks ago and also installed all new fuel lines, fuel pump, and rebuilt the carb so she has fresh fuel and oil and the carb has all new components. Do i still need to put some carb cleaner in? And yes if you have any tips on adjusting the carb that would be great the only reference on how to adjust it is in the original owners manual i have. I plan on trying to do this later thisafternoon. Thanks so much.

Jake

 

[ostendorfg]

Jake, Sounds like you have fresh fuel. Probably don't need carb cleaner but it wouldn't hurt. The Sea Foam really helps to keep fuel fresh and the carb clean. It's up to you. I usually dump a little in everything that will be setting for a while in the fall. You are best to follow your manual for adjusting the carb. I normally rev the engine up about 3/4 throttle and adjust the high speed jet first. It's probably on the bottom of your carb where the bowl is bolted on. It's best to do it under a load. Thats pretty difficult to do without getting run over. I slowly adjust it until the engine smoots out. Then I bring the throttle back to an idle. There should be an idle speed adjustment screw. I make the engine idle as slow as possible. Then I adjust the idle / air adjustment to where it reaches the highest rpm. I then lower the idle again to the lowest possible without stalling. I go back and adjust the idle / air again to the highest rpm. That should do it. Let me know how you make out. By the way, when you cleaned the carb did you remove the high speed jet and clean the small holes in the side of it? Gary...............

 

[firenems335]

Gary, for the jet with the small holes i relaced that with a new one and all the small components as in the float, bowl, needles, gaskets. I am assuming that as of right now it should it should work top notch especially after adjustment.... or it should for purchasing all new replacement parts for the entire fuel system. The way you described for adjustment is right there with what the manual is telling me, i appreciate all the time you have spent helping me out. You are very knowledgable about this and has been a very valuable tool for me, again, thank you. I will post later on how it goes.
Jake