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Well, if you jump from the battery direct to the starter the starter engages and the engine spins, correct? Or does only the starter spin but not the engine?

Where are you located? (state and nearby city?)


That starter you found on Amazon shows for Cub Cadet. Did it cross reference up?
 

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A second solenoid may (??) send more power to your starter solenoid and apply more pressure to the contacts. BUT! I believe you ran a wire from the battery directly to the starter solenoid and heard a "loud click" but the starter motor didn't turn over. You NEED a new solenoid, so quit fartin' around and get one! Bob
 

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OK, I didn't click on the Amazon link, thinking it was just a VERY expansive solenoid! Remove your solenoid and take it to auto parts store. They'll cross reference it and get you just the solenoid...maybe $50 MAX, but thinking more like $20. Bob
 

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Discussion Starter · #64 ·
Well, if you jump from the battery direct to the starter the starter engages and the engine spins, correct? Or does only the starter spin but not the engine?

Where are you located? (state and nearby city?)


That starter you found on Amazon shows for Cub Cadet. Did it cross reference up?
Well, if you jump from the battery direct to the starter the starter engages and the engine spins, correct? Or does only the starter spin but not the engine?

Just the starter spins. The engine tries to and sometimes does, but now it seems that just the starter is spinning.

Where are you located? (state and nearby city?)
Eastern Shore of Maryland, closest city would be Annapolis MD or Dover, DE.


That starter you found on Amazon shows for Cub Cadet. Did it cross reference up?
The DB Electrical part references as replacement for the JD MIA13172 which is the same part # provided to me by the JD dealer's parts dept. The OEM MIA13172 retails for around $380. The Amazon reviews on this unit are mixed, one said this in 2016: "There were mixed reviews on this when I bought it, but mine is working great on my John Deere STX 38 with Kohler 12.5HP (1215) engine. The original starter had on less for tooth count, smaller gear, but this one fits perfectly with a larger gear and extra tooth. Turns over strong, no more click, click, click.. start of the original which had bad solenoid contacts that did not respond well to cleaning. When I looked at the OEM starter via the dealer, it was about $250, so I lived with the intermittent solenoid for years.. but this for about $40 is a bargain! "

I try to avoid Amazon and this probably also available direct from the retailer at DBElectrical: Starters, Alternators and More to Keep Your Vehicle Running but Prime does have its perks...
OK, I didn't click on the Amazon link, thinking it was just a VERY expansive solenoid! Remove your solenoid and take it to auto parts store. They'll cross reference it and get you just the solenoid...maybe $50 MAX, but thinking more like $20. Bob
I looked at aftermarket solenoids, but they all have crappy or no reviews. With this DB Electric unit, there are over 500 reviews, and basically you're getting the starter/solenoid for the same price as a new OEM solenoid.

But Bob is absolutely right -- i have to quit hemming and hawing and just pull the damned trigger so I think I'm going to just go for the Amazon one for $79...

And then if I get lucky I can start thinking about why the aftermarket PTO clutch didn't engage, which is what this whole thread is actually supposed to be about.
 

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Discussion Starter · #66 ·
And I'm going to wait and see what Brad says about the starter spinning but not cranking the engine :)
 

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From the pic I...finally... saw on Amazon, that's a solenoid shift starter solenoid. It's very possible you've got some shorted windings in the solenoid and it doesn't have enough strength to engage the pinion. I don't know the ohm value of the coil, so can't tell you how to check. Also, if you jump from pos battery to starter, nothing is "telling" the shift arm to extend the pinion... solenoid does that I'd say normal for starter motor to spin and not engage flywheel. Bob
 

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Discussion Starter · #68 ·
From the pic I...finally... saw on Amazon, that's a solenoid shift starter solenoid. It's very possible you've got some shorted windings in the solenoid and it doesn't have enough strength to engage the pinion. I don't know the ohm value of the coil, so can't tell you how to check. Also, if you jump from pos battery to starter, nothing is "telling" the shift arm to extend the pinion... solenoid does that I'd say normal for starter motor to spin and not engage flywheel. Bob
Agreed. This unit is sealed and can't be rebuilt, so the only option is to toss it in the trash and get a new one.
 

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I have a STX 30 and have gone through the same problem. Tuned out it was a bad ground connection cuz had voltage but not amps. Check your air gap as it’s just like the clutch adjustment on a truck. The coil only pulls the disk up so far and if it’s too far away as in large air gap it won’t grip enough. You can check current by putting military tester between clutch case and battery ground and if you get more than a tenth of a volt your ground is corroded.
 

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Discussion Starter · #70 ·
I have a STX 30 and have gone through the same problem. Tuned out it was a bad ground connection cuz had voltage but not amps. Check your air gap as it’s just like the clutch adjustment on a truck. The coil only pulls the disk up so far and if it’s too far away as in large air gap it won’t grip enough. You can check current by putting military tester between clutch case and battery ground and if you get more than a tenth of a volt your ground is corroded.
Oh boy. You're talking about the air gap in the PTO clutch?
 

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Motorhobo,
Before you toss it it the trash and buy a new one do part of what you saw of the video some one posted. Make up a jumper wire with one large terminal that will fit where the battery cable connects to the solenoid and put a female spade end on the other end, remove solenoid wire from the ignition switch and connect to that terminal. Use your jumper cable from the positive battery post and touch the large solenoid terminal where you placed the jumper with the large ring terminal and see if the starter runs and turns the motor over. If it runs and doesn't engage the flywheel ring gear you will know for sure that the solenoid is bad!!

startocast56
 

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Discussion Starter · #72 ·
Motorhobo,
Before you toss it it the trash and buy a new one do part of what you saw of the video some one posted. Make up a jumper wire with one large terminal that will fit where the battery cable connects to the solenoid and put a female spade end on the other end, remove solenoid wire from the ignition switch and connect to that terminal. Use your jumper cable from the positive battery post and touch the large solenoid terminal where you placed the jumper with the large ring terminal and see if the starter runs and turns the motor over. If it runs and doesn't engage the flywheel ring gear you will know for sure that the solenoid is bad!!

startocast56
All right -- I'll do that as soon as I get done what I'm doing right now, which is drinking beer and eating chicken. So...I'll be back tomorrow morning. This tractor s driving me to excessive beer consumption and overeating!

I think I might just try the lazy-man's approach -- get me a new one and see if it works and if it doesn't then you know the problem is somewhere else. That's what Amazon Prime is for...free returns.
 

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motorhobo,
If you find out that the solenoid is bad here is a link for a replacement solenoid that is for your model tractor and starter.


stratocast56
 

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My ground was bad at the engine block connection. Both of your problems, selenoid and pro clutch require a lot of amps. If there is a bad ground the current can’t get back to battery and the two coils, selenoid and pto won’t pull in with the strength they need to work properly. Hope this is clear enough.
 

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I've run into grounding problems on the clutch as well, and with the engine actually becoming loose on it's mount losing ground.

Van, for that price for the starter and new solenoid, go for it as long as it will fit. That way, all your possibilities have been cleared. If you get just a new solenoid (which the one shown by stratocast56 is a great price!) and there is something else wrong, then you have to throw more money at it.

One more thing to try, after you are done drinking beer and eating chicken. Get your jumper cables. black to ground on the battery, other end to the engine near the starter area. Red to + on the battery, other end to the outside big lug on the solenoid. Turn key and see if solenoid activates and makes anything rotate. Just too strange that all this took place at once. (Just for giggles, while doing this unplug the new clutch)

Goodluck!! Keep posting.
 

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Discussion Starter · #76 ·
motorhobo,
If you find out that the solenoid is bad here is a link for a replacement solenoid that is for your model tractor and starter.


stratocast56
Hey statocast56,
I saw that one, it's the same Chinese unit that's sold on Amazon and eBay by at least a dozen vendors. Some of the Amazon sellers have been selling it long enough to accumulate reviews, which aren't very good. I opted for the starter/solenoid unit because at least DB Electronics has a client-facing website and and a BBB listing which means a reputation to uphold.
 

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Discussion Starter · #77 ·
I've run into grounding problems on the clutch as well, and with the engine actually becoming loose on it's mount losing ground.

Van, for that price for the starter and new solenoid, go for it as long as it will fit. That way, all your possibilities have been cleared. If you get just a new solenoid (which the one shown by stratocast56 is a great price!) and there is something else wrong, then you have to throw more money at it.

One more thing to try, after you are done drinking beer and eating chicken. Get your jumper cables. black to ground on the battery, other end to the engine near the starter area. Red to + on the battery, other end to the outside big lug on the solenoid. Turn key and see if solenoid activates and makes anything rotate. Just too strange that all this took place at once. (Just for giggles, while doing this unplug the new clutch)

Goodluck!! Keep posting.
Thanks Brad! I have a feeling this isn't over and I myself am not 100% convinced it's not a ground issue -- I agree that it's strange that it happened in conjunction with the PTO Clutch replacement. Having said that, I've had starting issues since I got it -- which could be BOTH ground-related as well as signs of a failing solenoid. We'll see when I get the starter/solenoid on Friday. BTW, when I inherited this tractor which had been sitting for at least 4 years, first thing I did was take it to the dealer and give it the $600 once-over and tech evaluation. One of the things they fixed was loose and deteriorated engine mounts ;-)

If I ever so get this and the PTO clutch issue resolved, we'll have to put the resolutions in new threads... no one could be expected to ever read this never-ending post.
 

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When you get everything put back together I would suggest not connecting the starter assist relay just yet. See what happens without it, and if needed you can hook it up then when you are sure it's wired correctly

You can verify the relay for the starter assist is working by putting - to ground + to positive and touching either of the 2 remaining wires to +. Relay should click. Just do it to the tractor power while changing the starter if that is convenient.

Stay in touch!
 

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Motorhobo, I have not looked through this entire posting about your progress on the PTO.

I also have a stx 38, But mine is a black deck. I got it because my fiancee's ex had it at their house as their main mower. It has all manner of jacked up wiring and jury rigged ways to make it go. I had planned to sort thru the wiring rats nests to try to return it to using the factory components properly. As it sits, A full sized battery with top posts and additional threaded terminals sits in the center between one's legs. Wires with gator clips get attached n detached to run the pto. I even remember using a jumper screw driver on solenoid to fire up the tractor when i did use it the few times. So, obviously curious to see all you and others post about your STX 38's and their quirks, or strengths, fixes, mods variations.
 

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Discussion Starter · #80 ·
Well since I have y'alls attention --

The aftermarket PTO clutch wiring connector is garbage and the connector came off while I was disconnecting it, and I'm not 100% sure they did not get crossed when I put the connector back together (95% sure, but that leaves 5% not sure, which I don't like at all). Both of the wires are black. How can I tell which is power and which is ground and what happens if they were crossed and I throw the PTO switch?
 
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