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The more Al says, the more it sounds like the screen to oil pump line and fittings are clogged. I've seen more than one pump ruined by the stuff making it all the way to the gears.
 

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well guys ... guess what. i took the front high low housing off and drained the oil. ok so i stick my hand under the gear and it felt ..how do i say a swamp in there. so i took the right side wheels off and the gear and pulled the sump and screen out. it was stopped up with about an inch thick of what looked like mud. i pretty sure this wasnt in there at the time of rebuild. it has been sabotaged before the rebuild . but my screen is round and made of brass. the tube is round the end is blocked off with a hole bored in the side. is this factory or has sombody made this.
 

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Discussion Starter #65
Here is everything needed to convert to a high volume oil pump. The pictures would be better if the guy washed the parts.



http://www.ebay.com/itm/Gravely-Model-L-LI-C8-Oil-Pump-w-Cover-Walk-behind-Engine-/281400762277?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4184cadfa5



Roger,

Roger,
From the info above in regards to the lower end rebuild, the Con Rod was not drilled for the high volume oil pump. Don't forget that when gravely issued the service bulletin to upgrade a low volume oiling system to a high volume system a new Con Rod was required, or if the engine has the newer rod to drill two holes to allow oil to escape, also he would have to drill the forward case half to allow for the oil to drain out if the case.

The early engines were wet sumps with the low volume oil pump, presumingly to allow for better lubrication with the smaller volume pump. Roger you have Way me experience on these machines, so perhaps adding a high volume oil pump without drilling the rod is acceptable so long as the case is still a wet sump. I've attached a link to the Service bulletin for reference.

http://www.gravelytractorclub.org/images/PDFs/manuals/walk-behind/model-l/Oil_Pump_Conversion.pdf


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Discussion Starter #66
well guys ... guess what. i took the front high low housing off and drained the oil. ok so i stick my hand under the gear and it felt ..how do i say a swamp in there. so i took the right side wheels off and the gear and pulled the sump and screen out. it was stopped up with about an inch thick of what looked like mud. i pretty sure this wasnt in there at the time of rebuild. it has been sabotaged before the rebuild . but my screen is round and made of brass. the tube is round the end is blocked off with a hole bored in the side. is this factory or has sombody made this.

Wow! Well at least you found the oiling issue. This is the big down side to having a low pressure, bypass oiling system, the oil is not filtered prior to going to the engine. I'm not sure what your plans are for this tractor but with all the time and money you put into the rebuild it may do you good to disassemble to ensure none if that "mudd" got I to the crank. Is this "mudd" gritty?


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Gravely bug bit.
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Wow! Well at least you found the oiling issue. This is the big down side to having a low pressure, bypass oiling system, the oil is not filtered prior to going to the engine. I'm not sure what your plans are for this tractor but with all the time and money you put into the rebuild it may do you good to disassemble to ensure none if that "mudd" got I to the crank. Is this "mudd" gritty?


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If it is anything like I've seen, the mud is really mud. There may be some fine metal particles in there but mostly it is dirt that gets sucked in thru the breather over the years. Really bad at it if it is in a clay soil area as the particles are finer. I sometimes wonder if it wouldn't be worthwhile plumbing a line from the filler port to the air cleaner and doing away with the factory style breather cap. Interesting side effect of that would be that the piston would then draw air into the crankcase when the engine is not pulling air for combustion. And force it out when the piston is sucking it in for combustion.

As for the screen/pre-filter in the bottom, it sounds like the screen itself is missing.
 

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Discussion Starter #68
@ Fla Don, I've thought about that my self, basically create a PCV system, the down side to that is all the oil vapor that will get sucked into the intake, good upper cylinder lubrication though. How about foam warped around the breather, similar to the foam pre-filter on air cleaners.


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Tuning-in late here...

What is still available in the way of oil pump parts for the Gravely L :

1) Any parts for the old low-volume pump ?

2) Any parts for the high-volume pump ?

3) Conversion parts ?
 

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yea it was gritty. there was a lil oil in the pump housing and sump. it was clean oil though. i pulled the wheel housing off and did my work thru there . didnt plan on pulling the engine back off.
i think ima put it back together when my i get new gasket and seal. and see if the pressure comes back
 

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Gravely Frank,

Mostly what you see on eBay. Exactly what are you looking for? Richard's still has many parts.

Roger,
Wondering if anyone had started producing oil-pump parts...

When I last checked-into the L oil-pump, back in the mid-1980's, the Gravely agencies told me that parts of the old-style pump were few and far-between, as were the upgrade parts...

At the moment, I don't [think] I need anything, but I have two old-style L's that might need help in that dept, when I get around to them.

So for the time-being, we're scrounging old-stock and used parts for the old-style oil-pump ?

Thanks...

Frank
 

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Discussion Starter #74
Wondering if anyone had started producing oil-pump parts...



When I last checked-into the L oil-pump, back in the mid-1980's, the Gravely agencies told me that parts of the old-style pump were few and far-between, as were the upgrade parts...



At the moment, I don't [think] I need anything, but I have two old-style L's that might need help in that dept, when I get around to them.



So for the time-being, we're scrounging old-stock and used parts for the old-style oil-pump ?



Thanks...



Frank

I don't believe there are many parts in production for the L engines, Pistons, about $90-each are about it. I don't believe the oil pumps wear much but as Roger pointed out it can happen, gaskets are about all that can be purchased new. Cylinders are no longer made, not that they were affordable when new. Forget about any new low volume oil pump parts, occasionally NOS parts can be fond, and Todd White at GT Gravely Enterprises had been able, in the past had a source for new less expensive pistons through last I heard that had dried up as well. Gene Bender has managed to be able to Properly rebuild Governors, his service is on ebay, something around $100 +/- a few bucks gets a totally rebuilt Governor. The later rear facing aluminum carburetors are available new for around $250.00. Richard's lawn and Garden has a great selection of new and used Gravely parts, together with Todd White and a few others a Gravely L can be kept alive for many years.

Both Todd and Richard offer Gravely engine rebuild services, Todd has done a great job at sourcing new, more modern engine parts such as better valves, valve guides and gaskets, as well as a few other Gravely nuts, bolts, bearings, etc etc...


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Discussion Starter #75
Corry,



Thanks for pointing out that instruction sheet, I had not seen that before. There is more to it than I thought.



Roger,

Yeah no problem Roger, at fist I had no idea of how involved the conversion was, I've read gravely publications that state the conversion needs to be completely done or possible risk of engine damage could occur.

There is such a thing as too much oil pressure to an engines bearings. The low pressure engines were wet sumps engines which employed splash lubrication, with the move to a higher volume, full flow oiling system a dry sump was deemed necessary as well oil squirters were drilled at the base of the Conn Rod, this helps lubricate the cams and cylinder walls. I would assume that at this time the newer valve cages with oil return grooves were used.

While the new high volume full flow oiling system is a better design proper oil pressure is even more important, what with the lack of wet sump and oil first going to the engine no oil pressure is a sure engine killer. I truly feel the low pressure engines can handle lower oil pressure better then the newer high volume engines.

My low pressure engine has a new style Conn Rod with no oil squirters at the big end, though there are two holes drilled in the top of the small end of the Conn Rod. At one time this engine has been rebuilt/reassembled with newer parts, as this engine should have spring loaded valve cages and the plus shaped Conn Rod. The engine I speak of has a sand cast case, and protruding intake camshaft, sadly the serial plate was removed so I can only guess as to the manufacture year of early 50's.


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that sounds alot like my 54 gravely. the holes in the rod and the protruding intake cam shaft. and the springs on the valve cages.
 

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Discussion Starter #77
that sounds alot like my 54 gravely. the holes in the rod and the protruding intake cam shaft. and the springs on the valve cages.

Cool
Keep in mind the low pressure Gravely's are no less capable of a machine, they can be used just as hard, this is what I do service wise.

Update to the moderne spin on oil filter, per Gravely's instructions. The oil plumbing configuration is as follows, the oil exits the pump and goes to the T fitting on the side if the engine, then to the filter, and finally to the pressure relieve valve. If at all posable change over to the later oil pickup screen.

If used heavily I Change oil and filter half way through the mowing season, remember this is a wet sump engine, so drain the oil from the case during the oil change. There is a small plug screwed into the bottom of the case, about a 1/4 cup or more will drain out.

Prior to shutdown I allow the engine a 5 minute cool down at idle.

I use a Fram PH8 filter as it's an easy number to remember as well I use straight weight 40 oil in the summer.

An added feature is a low pressure, 0-15psi oil pressure gauge, I found an OEM Gravely low pressure oil gauge on ebay for $30-. ImageUploadedByMyTractorForum Free App1407067896.751940.jpg


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Well, I just disassembled the bottom end on my '61 LI to straighten the wobbling crankshaft. This tractor clearly came with the factory high pressure/volume lube system. It has the L-863 connecting rod in it. (The number is stamped in the forging.)

I expected there to be hole in the bottom of the big end of the rod, but there is not one. I thought the hole was part of what allowed greater oil flow. Or is the hole only supposed to be added to the older L-306 rod?
 

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Discussion Starter #79
Well, I just disassembled the bottom end on my '61 LI to straighten the wobbling crankshaft. This tractor clearly came with the factory high pressure/volume lube system. It has the L-863 connecting rod in it. (The number is stamped in the forging.)



I expected there to be hole in the bottom of the big end of the rod, but there is not one. I thought the hole was part of what allowed greater oil flow. Or is the hole only supposed to be added to the older L-306 rod?

There should be two small holes on either side of the rod on the top of the big end, not sure if early high pressure tractors has this or not. Are there holes drilled toward the bottom in the forward case half? Like I said I have a low pressure engine with later rod with no oil squirter holes.


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The L-863 rod in this unit has the two holes in the upper side of the big end for squirting oil on the piston/wrist pin/cylinder/rings. That's a common design and I think they all have those. Just no hole in the bottom.

Those conversion instructions describe drilling a hole in the BOTTOM of the big end of the old L-306 con rod, or replacing it with the newer L-863 con rod. The intent is to allow more oil flow out of the pressurized area of the bearing there. I had assumed that the newer rod had this hole already drilled, but that may be an incorrect assumption. The newer rod may simply have larger clearances to allow more oil flow, and the hole is not needed.
 
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