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Discussion Starter #41
So if you had great oil pressure before and you know for sure the oil pump is working then there has got or be a clog, or as Roger said the oil is all escaping to the high low planetary set. Did you happen to notice what the pressure was prior to no pressure?

My concern is that this engine was a low pressure system when new, has it been upgrade since? You've stated that you installed a new drive pinion bushing and rod bushing, was the Con rod drilled for the high pressure pump? Was the oil pickup screen changed to the later designe? Was a high pressure pump installed? What's really good is that you did all the work, so you know exactly what was replaced, no guessing.


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im not sure about the oil pump being up graded or not. or the drilled crank pin. and yes the pressure was fine and all at once i checked the oil flow and there was none. even changed the oil and ran it a while un screwed the filter and it was still dry. thats when it was shut down till now. i didnt like what i saw. must be fixed.
 

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Allis,

As Don mentioned above the oil pump drive gear inside the engine case fits on a tapered shaft with a tiny-tiny Woodruft key.

Which way are your oil lines connected?

n_a.jpg

Low.jpg

By the way the flywheel assembly end play is controlled by ring shims behind the oil pump, against that roller bearing inside.

Roger,
 

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i dont think its a sheared key and from the looks of this i have low pressure oil system. im going to take the front of the trans apart and look at the strainer. and fix the end play. where would one get the end play bearing shims. i saw this on you tube,
 

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Al, sounds better than Allice :-}

A sheared key would be a devil to find, the slip would only occur under a heavy load, otherwise the gears still turn. You could remove the oil pump body and place a tooth pick in the gears to stall them, and then try turning the timing pinion shaft to see what happens.

Richard's Lawn & Garden should be able to help you out with shims.
http://www.gravelyparts.com/

You will find that the oil pick up tube on your tractor is a good sized(3/4?) pipe with some screen on the pick up end.

Hey, look what I found on Wiki,

Gear_pump.png

Roger,
 

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im a BIG ALLIS CHALMERS fan and owner. lol thats where i got the name. i named my lawn mower alice lol allis chalmers 616. i like the nick names al tho. i got the cover off. ill try the tooth pick idea and see.
 

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Al,

What does the inside of your oil pump body look like? Can you post a close up photo?

Looking at that pirated Wiki image, you should be able to measure a 'working' ID of the oil pump housing, and maybe measure across the tips of the oil pump gears. **** if I know what a new oil pump housing has for gear clearance, but it should be pretty small if you wish to build up good oil pressure. Does your oil pump idler gear have much play on its pin?

If you remove the oil pump idler, is there circle worn into the rear case?

Roger,
 

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Big Al,

I have to stop and look where we have come from and I wish we knew where we are headed.

1. You have an older tractor with a low volume oil pump
2. You said you rebuilt the bottom end with new crank pin and con rod bushing.
3. You said there is a new style drive pinion bushing on the flywheel assembly.

Ok, is there a new style spin off filter on this tractor? How are the oil lines plumbed?
Does oil from the pump go to a 'T' on the side of the engine case or does the oil line go straight to the input of a spin on filter?

Roger,
 

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Discussion Starter #56
Wow this is centenary a hard issue to troubleshoot, since we know you had oil pressure before and now you don't what would cause this?

Oil pump not operating, false, you've checked and proven that the oil pump operates and does not slip on the driven shaft

Oil pick-up line, is it blocked, or....is there a hole somewhere that is preventing suction???? Check for loose oil pump supply lines as well as pressure lines for blockages.

It's doubtful excessive clearance in the pump housing is the cause since you had good pressure after the rebuild.

Hay Roger isn't there a plug at the end of the drive pinion shaft that prevents complete oil pressure loss? I know oil is allowed to escape to allow for lubrication of the high-low planetary, but if too much that could be the source of pressure loss.

Oh and I've got to ask this, I'm NOT trying to be an A$$....is there enough oil in the tractor?




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Corry,

Yes there is an allen plug screw in the end of a drive pinion shaft, which is almost never removed, but...

A complete loss of oil pressure sounds like a major blockage somewhere, or that the pump just cannot 'prime' itself after a shut down, but normally oil stays in those lines for years. I hope the oil filter has a backflow stop valve.

If Al can turn the timing pinion shaft and see the oil pump gears turning, then this sounds like a blockage. It may be time to remove individual lines and check for debris, especially the line to the oil filter, any right angle fittings in that line? After what I found in the oil supply line to a pump, I think anything is possible.

You say you had great oil pressure, how did you measure that? is there and oil pressure gauge?

Roger,
 

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yes the tractor does have plenty of oil in fact i just changed it over this past weekend. sae 40 . and last year it had a strong stream coming out of the relief valve. even after shut down if u was fast enough u could take the cap of and it would slowly stop the flow of oil. im thinking blockage at this point. i wont kno for a while gotta wait for my new gasket and crank seal.
 
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