It's strange how people end up with different experiences. I've refurbed and sold at least 20 L100 series units and they all steered just like the OP's machine. I didn't realize it was an issue until I got higher line JDs that had proper engineering applied to the steering geometry and would turn super sharp without pushing.
John Deere L120 Turning Radius
Picked up a used L120 and have a problem with the turning on it. Mechanically, it appears fine. You turn the steering wheel, the front wheels turn in the direction you want, BUT you continue moving forward only gradually turning in the direction you want. The turf tyres still have a well defined tread pattern and are inflated to sidewall spec. They just seem to float over the ground. On an asphalt paved surface they do grip a bit better but still appear to float. This is all at slow forward speed roughly one third to one half max forward speed and level ground.
Thinking of getting some ag style ATV tyres for the front or would some type of front weights perform better? Any opinions to solve the problem would be appreciated.
Thinking of getting some ag style ATV tyres for the front or would some type of front weights perform better? Any opinions to solve the problem would be appreciated.
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Well that is interesting. My experience is about 8 years and over 400 hours on a L120. I had no issues with the machine as to turning radius. Indeed no issues period with routine maintenance. Traded it for an X540. No comparison on the ease of steering with the hydraulics but basically similar turning radius. Just saying.
Need more info on the front spindles and bushings.
Need more info on the front spindles and bushings.
OK, please describe to me what I'll be looking at here with the front spindles & bushings. I haven't been all that deep on this, yet. Waiting on a part for the mower deck that broke while mowing. The idler spring tip where it hooks in the deck rusted through and broke. To me, that's normal for used equipment, something works until it just can't. This steering just isn't normal for me.Well that is interesting. My experience is about 8 years and over 400 hours on a L120. I had no issues with the machine as to turning radius. Indeed no issues period with routine maintenance. Traded it for an X540. No comparison on the ease of steering with the hydraulics but basically similar turning radius. Just saying.
Need more info on the front spindles and bushings.
Upon further contemplation and rereading what has been posted, I'm a bit unsure of what the spindles and bushings have to do with the tyres floating over the ground and not gripping to turn. The steering appears fine: I turn the steering wheel, the wheels turn in the direction I would like to travel, there is very little to none slop in the steering itself, the wheels continue to rotate. The turf tyres still have well defined tread. It is just that the tyres appear to float and not grip the ground to make almost any type of turn, certainly nothing precise.
I'll be constructing a weight box to fit over the front bumper and fill it with 80 pounds of concrete in a couple of days. I'll see how that works.
I'll be constructing a weight box to fit over the front bumper and fill it with 80 pounds of concrete in a couple of days. I'll see how that works.
My L110 J-D has plastic front wheel bushings--and they need replacing,they are sloppy and likely never had any grease put on them..
If the wheels cant spin freely on the spindles,they will want to stop turning when you cut the wheel to make a turn,the slop in the bushings can make the toe in and camber change,and if they drag on the spindle the tire will tend to want to skid ,rather than roll,and skidding tires result in the front end wanting to go straight ahead instead of turning..
Adding weight might force the tires into better contact with the ground and seem to correct the issue,but if your wheel bushings are plastic they will wear down quickly and probably make it worse soon..
If the wheels cant spin freely on the spindles,they will want to stop turning when you cut the wheel to make a turn,the slop in the bushings can make the toe in and camber change,and if they drag on the spindle the tire will tend to want to skid ,rather than roll,and skidding tires result in the front end wanting to go straight ahead instead of turning..
Adding weight might force the tires into better contact with the ground and seem to correct the issue,but if your wheel bushings are plastic they will wear down quickly and probably make it worse soon..
Thank you for that bit of info, Tractor-Holic.
No the bushings I have on the front wheels are steel, or at the very least some type of metal as I didn't check with a magnet. With the front jacked up, both front wheels turn freely, that I have checked.
No the bushings I have on the front wheels are steel, or at the very least some type of metal as I didn't check with a magnet. With the front jacked up, both front wheels turn freely, that I have checked.
Every L100 series unit I messed with had steel bushings.
I would start out at 40 lbs. The steering gear on these units wear out fast and adding excess wgt will wear it out even faster.
I would start out at 40 lbs. The steering gear on these units wear out fast and adding excess wgt will wear it out even faster.
I'll have to check my wheel bushings then,I could swear they were not metal--maybe they were changed before ?....at any rate they are quite sloppy and need replacing,and I'd prefer brass over plastic --ball bearings might be even better if I can locate some the right OD and ID..plastic ones wear out quick and can eat away at the spindle once they do..
I am "new" to J-D riding mowers,this is the first one I've ever owned..
The steering on it to me feels much to stiff,like it doesn't have enough gear reduction,its more like a go-cart,where the "lock to lock" turns only take about 1 or two revolutions of the steering wheel,it is much harder to steer than my old Sears Suburban,which is a tank in comparison as far as overall weight goes.that thing feels like power steering in comparison,I can steer it with a suicide knob and one hand easily--the J-D takes both hands and a fairly hard pull to take a corner..
The king pins probably could use greasing,I ran out of grease when I was prepping it to mow with,I bought more but its been too darn hot to do much of anything in my metal garage,its like an oven in there..
I am "new" to J-D riding mowers,this is the first one I've ever owned..
The steering on it to me feels much to stiff,like it doesn't have enough gear reduction,its more like a go-cart,where the "lock to lock" turns only take about 1 or two revolutions of the steering wheel,it is much harder to steer than my old Sears Suburban,which is a tank in comparison as far as overall weight goes.that thing feels like power steering in comparison,I can steer it with a suicide knob and one hand easily--the J-D takes both hands and a fairly hard pull to take a corner..
The king pins probably could use greasing,I ran out of grease when I was prepping it to mow with,I bought more but its been too darn hot to do much of anything in my metal garage,its like an oven in there..
I can understand your perspective, but I am single and on a limited fixed income (SSD). That means I just don't have the spare change to make continuous alterations.Every L100 series unit I messed with had steel bushings.
I would start out at 40 lbs. The steering gear on these units wear out fast and adding excess wgt will wear it out even faster.
Tractor-Holic: Warm is where it's at! Quite cool today at only 87° and 65% humidity. But outside doing some concrete prep work digging for the forms that I'll mix & pour tomorrow.
Bearings JD part# you will need is AM127304 .also if needing to adjust toe in or toe out, you will want to adjust the draglinks. I would take the wheel off though and check out what the spindles look like first, while you have them off take punch out the bushings and replace with the bearings I listed above, you will need 2 for each side, should have a washer on each side of the bearings too, makes a tighter fit when putting back on the c-clip.
2 bearings, 2 washers and 1 c-clip for each wheel.
2 bearings, 2 washers and 1 c-clip for each wheel.
Thank you for that, Jimbochap.Bearings JD part# you will need is AM127304 .also if needing to adjust toe in or toe out, you will want to adjust the draglinks. I would take the wheel off though and check out what the spindles look like first, while you have them off take punch out the bushings and replace with the bearings I listed above, you will need 2 for each side, should have a washer on each side of the bearings too, makes a tighter fit when putting back on the c-clip.
2 bearings, 2 washers and 1 c-clip for each wheel.
As I said earlier today, I somehow just don't think the front wheels are the problem. When raised in the air and rotated, the wheels turn freely with no grinding, flat spots or any type of hesitation. That indicates to me that they are fine. I also don't have the spare change to be throwing it away on replacing perfectly good parts. It's either Amazon or the JD dealer 50 miles away and I can't afford the gas. My truck gets filled once a month.
The front wheels are rotating fine, the steering is working fine. The problem is that the tyres just float over the ground and do not have any grip even though there is well defined tread, they are not slicks. I can agree that my fat *** may be a problem with the weight distribution.
Cost you nothing to take the dust caps off, un-clip the C-clip, slide the wheel off and look at the spindles. If the wheels come of easy, spindles are probably okay, if they get hung up sliding them off you probably have some where on the spindles, might just be only one that needs replacing.Thank you for that, Jimbochap.
As I said earlier today, I somehow just don't think the front wheels are the problem. When raised in the air and rotated, the wheels turn freely with no grinding, flat spots or any type of hesitation. That indicates to me that they are fine. I also don't have the spare change to be throwing it away on replacing perfectly good parts. It's either Amazon or the JD dealer 50 miles away and I can't afford the gas. My truck gets filled once a month.
The front wheels are rotating fine, the steering is working fine. The problem is that the tyres just float over the ground and do not have any grip even though there is well defined tread, they are not slicks. I can agree that my fat *** may be a problem with the weight distribution.
I've already had the dust caps off and the wheels removed. I didn't know at that time that I was looking at the bushings and other. I was looking because I'm still thinking of getting different tyres and was rather curious of how easy they were to remove. My yard and turf tyres do not mix well, been there done that with other machines.
But when looking at everything I've posted, never once did I state anything about the wheels not rotating while turning. The wheels rotate just fine whether straight or at an angle. I watch them rotating as the tyres float over the ground continuing it's forward motion and keep wondering when the tyres are going to bite as I'm also looking ahead to see how close I am to running off the edge of the creek or hitting something.
I think that someone assumed that the wheels were not rotating or had a flat spot or something and everyone ran with that. I kept saying that the tyres don't grip and appear to float. The turf tyres have ample tread remaining.
On a side note, I purchased this L120 from the boss man of the service department of a local dealer of commercial mowing equipment. It was his personal mower he had bought new years ago. Mechanically, it is in good condition or appears to be. The engine area is extremely clean along with the underside.
But when looking at everything I've posted, never once did I state anything about the wheels not rotating while turning. The wheels rotate just fine whether straight or at an angle. I watch them rotating as the tyres float over the ground continuing it's forward motion and keep wondering when the tyres are going to bite as I'm also looking ahead to see how close I am to running off the edge of the creek or hitting something.
I think that someone assumed that the wheels were not rotating or had a flat spot or something and everyone ran with that. I kept saying that the tyres don't grip and appear to float. The turf tyres have ample tread remaining.
On a side note, I purchased this L120 from the boss man of the service department of a local dealer of commercial mowing equipment. It was his personal mower he had bought new years ago. Mechanically, it is in good condition or appears to be. The engine area is extremely clean along with the underside.
I have an L111 that was doing something similar. Turn the wheels and it would sort of lock up and go straight. I fixed it by replacing the Bushings in the front wheels.
If you jack up the front and their is a lot of play, then the bushings are bad. Just buy some, knock the old ones out and put them in.
You could also check that the steering gear is still good and the plate it messes with is tight.
If you jack up the front and their is a lot of play, then the bushings are bad. Just buy some, knock the old ones out and put them in.
You could also check that the steering gear is still good and the plate it messes with is tight.
The suggestions to take a hard look at the bushings (as well as the spindles themselves) in the wheels and kingpins is due to the fact that if they are worn and have slop in them, an already bad steering geometry becomes much worse which can cause issues that you are describing. If the angles are not correct, the tires lose their bite and will fight each other when you try to turn resulting in your tractor continuing to go straight when you want to turn.I watch them rotating as the tyres float over the ground continuing it's forward motion and keep wondering when the tyres are going to bite as I'm also looking ahead to see how close I am to running off the edge of the creek or hitting something.
I think that someone assumed that the wheels were not rotating or had a flat spot or something and everyone ran with that. I kept saying that the tyres don't grip and appear to float. The turf tyres have ample tread remaining.
As David Vines points out, he had a similar issue that was resolved by replacing the bushings. Unfortunately, the spindles can wear as well requiring replacement.
The suggestions are sound advice.
I also have a G110 which is the big brother to the L111, it needed new spindles and the bushings came with the spindles. The bushings on the G110 were good, so I looked at the L111 bushings. What looked fairly round with the eye became glaring clear with a new bushing placed over the old bushing.
I happened upon it by sheer chance.
I happened upon it by sheer chance.
I think what folks here are saying is that this situation you describe is not normal for this line of lawn tractors. This machine should have a turning radius of about 18". Not happening ….something is not right on the front end.
Wanted to give everyone an update on the problem with the turning radius.
I first tried to add weight to the front. Bolted up a platform that stuck out about a foot to the front bumper and added a 50 pound bag of sand. Took it for a test spin about the yard and there was a very minimal improvement. I knew that there was not anything wrong with the wheels or the steering. Then I got some new tyres for the front wheels. Major drastic improvement! My turning radius went from about 8 feet to about 3½ feet. Have some knobbies for the rear coming later this week.
Thank you all for your comments and suggestions.
I first tried to add weight to the front. Bolted up a platform that stuck out about a foot to the front bumper and added a 50 pound bag of sand. Took it for a test spin about the yard and there was a very minimal improvement. I knew that there was not anything wrong with the wheels or the steering. Then I got some new tyres for the front wheels. Major drastic improvement! My turning radius went from about 8 feet to about 3½ feet. Have some knobbies for the rear coming later this week.
Thank you all for your comments and suggestions.
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I'm glad that worked for you. If you would do something I'd like to hear the results. Back up around a circle and tell us how well it turns.
I found that my rear directional tires do not grip well in reverse. They'll pull a mountain fwd but won't back uphill worth a darn.
I found that my rear directional tires do not grip well in reverse. They'll pull a mountain fwd but won't back uphill worth a darn.
Now something I have noticed with this used lawn tractor is the reverse doesn't work all that well. But it is something I'm not overly concerned with as the only time I really use it is when I get stuck with these crappy turf tyres or putting it into the shed when done. I don't mow in reverse as I try to plan my routes without doing that. Anything else I have a push mower for.I'm glad that worked for you. If you would do something I'd like to hear the results. Back up around a circle and tell us how well it turns.
I found that my rear directional tires do not grip well in reverse. They'll pull a mountain fwd but won't back uphill worth a darn.
That said, I did motor it out and performed the test you wanted, Steve Urquell. Either forward or reverse, I'm still in the 3-4 foot diameter circle which is much better than the 8 or more foot one that it was. Also drove it around in reverse and the new front tyres steered and gripped nicely.
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