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Discussion Starter · #41 ·
That also looks like a relay which is another (more proper) name for a solenoid. Solenoid is really the electromagnet coil.
Normal the coil has a metal plunger that moves when power is applied to the coil. That plunger can then move some contacts that will make/break a circuit.

There is no way they are running starter current through the key switch and/or safeties. There is a big relay with big wires that go to the starter and battery that make the starter go, which starts the engine. It probably takes on the order of 100A to do that. That would burn up the contacts in a key switch the first time you tried it.
I just told you it was not there. The thing that is visible the circuit breaker part# is in post 34. I bought a two post today and the one jd says is installed Looks like a regular solenoid not that circuit breaker and I got down and looked the best I could under the tractor and there is not a hidden solenoid. I got no idea where where it is or if they removed it when they did that starter improvement kit or or what.
 

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Discussion Starter · #42 ·
Did you take them off or just spray the outside? You could have corrosion under them, I'd even remove the black part from it's mount and clean under it, likely it is grounded that way.
I just sprayed the boot off. should I have lifted the boot up?馃槼 I'm not an idiot.
 

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I would remove them off the posts and check them for corrosion, clean thoroughly and put back on. Corrosion is a killer of electrical cables, it causes increased resistance.
 

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Discussion Starter · #44 ·
This is what JD says is installed. It actually has a 3rd post. I bought it since is was under battery. Kinda hard to jump it with battery out. Oh yeah...
2518472
 

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That last thing pictured must be a solenoid = for what, for sure, I don't know. Surely, it is not a 25 AMP circuit breaker.
Aren't the starter solenoids different, and located differently - between the B & P series Onan engines on JD 318s?
 

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There were two different starters on the Onan, some had the solenoid on the starter and some didn't and they were located on the pedestal.
 

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I just told you it was not there.
I believe you. My point was you have to have one. As @PA318Guy said, there are two types of starters. One of them has the solenoid built in. If you have that type of starter, the solenoid on it could be bad, or the starter itself could be bad. If you or someone else replaced the starter and the new one doesn't have a solenoid and your tractor doesn't either, that is likely your problem.
 

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Maybe I missed it but have you said if you have p218 or b 43
If it p218 the selonoid is on the starter but b43 will have the starter selonoid you posted in your picture in post 44.I just went through what you said about the clicking and mine was a not tight wire on the circuit breaker but I had already put the starter improvement on mine.
From your #17 picture I would say you have a p218, you do have a p218 coil.then you would not have a separate solonoid.it would be on the starter.
 
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Gased,
As biker3777 posted, a P218G Onan engine in a 318 would have the starter solenoid on the starter motor. The solenoids for the B43G Onan engines were separate from the starter and were mounted in the pedestal, near the circuit breaker. Per the photos shown in posts #14 & #17, it sure seems your 318 has the P218, so I for one don't know what the AM105171 would be used for in your tractor. From Technical Manual 1590:

Organism Gesture Font Art Metal
Wheel Tire Land vehicle Vehicle Automotive tire
 

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The photo in post 26 is your new starter, correct? Well, the silver thing on top if it (2" dia, 3" long" is the solenoid.

I am getting in on this late in the game, but if you follow the large red cable off the battery, it is going to come to the solenoid.
 

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After reading back & forth on a few pages here, I'm getting TOTALLY confused as what Gassed has or needs!

If I'm reading everything correctly, he installed a rebuilt starter, JD # SE501871. This is a solenoid shift starter and REQUIRES a solenoid shift solenoid... to engage the pinion into the flywheel. This is what PA318 is referring to as, "the solenoid on the starter". The other type is mounted "somewhere" and is shown in post # 44. This will NOT work with the the JD # SE501871 starter! It will make the starter rotate, but it will not engage with the flywheel.

So, IF I'm reading everything correctly, we're back to 1st base, a solenoid issue... maybe!
My suggestions:
1. Make sure you have a round object bolted to the top of your starter motor and it has (at least) 3 posts on it, 2 large, maybe 5/16" or 3/8", and a small, either like a #10 (3/16") or a push-on type connector. This is your solenoid.
2. Remove whatever wire is on the small connector. Run a temporary wire from the positive battery terminal and touch to the terminal the wire came off of on the solenoid. If engine turns over, solenoid, battery, battery cable, ground(s), and starter motor is good! If it doesn't turn over, wiring someplace in tractor is bad!
3. If engine does not turn over jump from battery. One of the large terminals on the solenoid connect to the battery and the other to the starter. Connect jumper, as in "jumper cable for starting a car", to solenoid where it connects to battery, other end to pos terminal on battery and touch smaller terminal jumper to solenoid. If engine turns over, bad pos battery cable. If it doesn't turn over, bad solenoid.

DO these tests and we'll go from there. You've got a "new" starter motor, you say battery is good, so these tests will narrow done possibilities! Bob
 
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It鈥檚 been a while since Iva had a starter off but doesn鈥檛 the p218 bolt to the oil pan and and b43 bolt to the motor so if he bought a non selonoid starter it would not bolt to a selonoid included starter application?
 

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Gased,

I "think" you have a starter with a solenoid attached. It should have a significant sized wire.cable attached from the battery and a smaller wire from the (key switch and related cicuitry - possibly including a relay). If you take a wire directly from the battery and touch it to the terminal that this smaller wire goes to, it should energize the solenoid, which should throw the starter gear into the flywheel and internally provide 12v to the starter motor. If that does not happen, then either you don't actaully have 12V on the big wire/cable or your starter is bad or your starter is physically misaligned (in whch case you should hear the starter gear being thrown in, but it doesn't get fully into the flywheel and therefore doesn't allow the internal contacts to make for 12v to be fed to the motor).

Right now you weem to be chaing down a path of an external solenoid or an external start assist relay. That might be your prolem, but from what I think I've read, you have not proven that your starter works (maybe you did and I missed it)

Can you post a wider angle view of the starter that ou installed. I think that will clean up a lot of confusion.

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Discussion Starter · #55 ·
Well thanks for your question I do not have a new starter installed. My starter had been working perfectly and then it quit working without fanfare it just started clicking. I knew that if I took it to have it fixed and they said you need a starter that could end up costing me a lot more money than if I took the starter with me I'm going to own this for a long time so I didn't throw any money away by purchasing a starter to take with me so that the repair was simply a replace.

Now if the usual solenoid that you might find on an LA130 for instance is not on my tractor and it's actually the piece that is on the new starter which by the way is not supposed to be delivered until today and I can post a complete picture of it when I get it if I get it today. But I got down and looked I could clearly see the red cable coming from the battery attached to the installed starter and I could maybe see enough room to get a jump wire on one part of the solenoid it'd be very close The wire that I used to jump a solenoid is like a an 8 gauge solid insulated wire and I think it might go through there without me hitting anything to touch a solenoid post. But I've had the battery tested, I've checked the battery myself so those were two actions that said the battery was good I tried a new battery. But I come to find out that I bought the wrong battery because the posts are not in the right place my negative cable is about an inch to short so I didn't get to try the that new battery.

If I jump it will the brake safety prevent engine from turning? I am a one-man show.
 

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OK, you need to do 1 thing. With your battery hooked up, key in the ON position.

With the brake set take a wire (it can be a 12-16 ga, doesn't matter), run it from the + side of the battery and touch the solenoid where the small purple wire connects. That's all you need to do, then check back with us. My guess is that the engine is going to turn, and maybe start.

Isn't there a panel that can be removed from the side of the hood/cowl that will give you a bit of access to the starter area?


Well thanks for your question I do not have a new starter installed. My starter had been working perfectly and then it quit working without fanfare it just started clicking. I knew that if I took it to have it fixed and they said you need a starter that could end up costing me a lot more money than if I took the starter with me I'm going to own this for a long time so I didn't throw any money away by purchasing a starter to take with me so that the repair was simply a replace.

I am afraid I don't understand if you pulled the old starter off or not. If you did, my post above is not going to work.
 

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Brad, Different words, but EXACTLY what I suggested in my no. 2 in post #51 ! Bob
 
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Your
Brad, Different words, but EXACTLY what I suggested in my no. 2 in post #51 ! Bob
#51 post was very clear and concise. Nicely written. Thanks!
 

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This isn't the longest, but it is a long one for what should be relatively simple, "how to tell if my starter is bad or not".

Starters are very simple motors that, typically, either work or don't. But, there are also typically a lot of other stuff, like solenoids, relays, safeties, and wiring that also come into play with, does it work or doesn't it. If you know what you are doing, you can skip a lot of the troubleshooting steps and have success. Even if you don't, you can just replace parts until it finally starts working or you give up in frustration. The other choice is proper troubleshooting to identify the actual source of the problem. Sometimes, there is more than one problem. When that is the case, proper troubleshooting is the difference between a one page thread and an eight page one. Looks like we are almost halfway to the latter.
 
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