My Tractor Forum banner
1 - 17 of 17 Posts

· Registered
Joined
·
34 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Fuel Pressure ? Installed a brand new mechanical fuel pump (gas) and gas sprays out brass valve at the top of the carburetor -British made Zenith carb ,Can anyone tell me what the recommended fuel pressure specification (PSI) is supposed to be ?
 

· Registered
Joined
·
852 Posts
Fuel Pressure ? Installed a brand new mechanical fuel pump (gas) and gas sprays out brass valve at the top of the carburetor -British made Zenith carb ,Can anyone tell me what the recommended fuel pressure specification (PSI) is supposed to be ?
2 to 4 PSI is the normal range is 6 PSI is the max.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
4 Posts
Not a direct answer but...

I gave up on the Zenith carb and put on the Solex that people are using on L-head 134 ci Willis Jeeps. For me it was a great improvement over the old Zenith which I had removed and cleaned (and which appeared to be in very usable condition)...I just couldn't get it to run right at higher RPM's and it didn't seem to respond quick enough when the hoe loaded the engine. I suppose some passage was plugged or the homemade gasket I cut wasn't right. Since the rebuild kit with a good gasket was getting close to the price of a new Solex carb it was an easy choice for me.

The Solex instructions say not to feed it at more than 2 PSI so I put an adjustable Fuel Pressure regulator in line (including a pressure gauge).

I got the idea from one of jdemaris' posts and am VERY happy I did it. Very straight forward conversion. I made a new governor linkage rod and threaded both ends to accept 10-32 tie rods; removed the plastic ball linkage studs from the governor and replaced with small bushing that tie rod fit thru; turned carb accelerator linkage around 90 degrees and drilled new hole in linkage arm to accept tie rod end up by carb. Important that this hole be same distance from center of pivot as the Zenith was (3/4" if memory serves). My 3444 doesn't have a factory air cleaner on it but I suspect even that would match up pretty close. The tall air intake on the Solex comes right off with little hammer tapping.

Good luck and I look forward to finding out more about your 3414.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
46 Posts
Not a direct answer but...

I gave up on the Zenith carb and put on the Solex that people are using on L-head 134 ci Willis Jeeps. For me it was a great improvement over the old Zenith which I had removed and cleaned.
I got the idea from one of jdemaris' posts and am VERY happy I did it. Very straight forward conversion. I made a new governor linkage rod and threaded both ends to accept 10-32 tie rods; removed the plastic ball linkage studs from the governor and replaced with small bushing that tie rod fit thru; turned carb accelerator linkage around 90 degrees and drilled new hole in linkage arm to accept tie rod end up by carb. Important that this hole be same distance from center of pivot as the Zenith was (3/4" if memory serves). My 3444 doesn't have a factory air cleaner on it but I suspect even that would match up pretty close. The tall air intake on the Solex comes right off with little hammer tapping.
Thank you very much for that info. I have a rebuild kit I picked up for $80.00 from a local auto parts store. If this doesn't work, I am going to repeat what you did!
 

· Registered
Joined
·
852 Posts
Thank you very much for that info. I have a rebuild kit I picked up for $80.00 from a local auto parts store. If this doesn't work, I am going to repeat what you did!
$80 is a lot for a kit - but I guess that's because the British Zenith is an odd- ball. If fuel is forcing though the carb, you've got a inlet needle problem most likely.

I've got three tractors with the British Zeniths and all work fine. I pulled all three carbs apart, cleaned and adjusted - but didn't need any new parts except for new generic inlet needles and gaskets. I made the gaskets myself. My point is - they are fairly simple and easy to work on. Jets get dirty, accel pumps get stuck, and inlet needles wear -like most carbs.

You didn't mention if you've got the VN or VNN carb. VN is the more complicated carb with an automotive-type accelerator pump and economy valve. The VNN is the stripped down cheaper version that lacks both of those features.

If your carb is just plain wore out -the do what the other guy did. Solex took over British Zenith and some Solex carbs used on Volkswagens are very similar. Carb on a Jeep is also close enough.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
46 Posts
$80 is a lot for a kit - but I guess that's because the British Zenith is an odd- ball. If fuel is forcing though the carb, you've got a inlet needle problem most likely.
I am not sure what is going on with my unit? It just seems like I always have to be messing with the choke to keep it running? Once it is warm it seems to be a little better, but it still has issues?

I've got three tractors with the British Zeniths and all work fine. I pulled all three carbs apart, cleaned and adjusted - but didn't need any new parts except for new generic inlet needles and gaskets. I made the gaskets myself. My point is - they are fairly simple and easy to work on. Jets get dirty, accel pumps get stuck, and inlet needles wear -like most carbs.
I am hoping that by taking it apart and cleaning it up along with some new goodies inside, it will work better so that I can move on the hydraulics?

You didn't mention if you've got the VN or VNN carb. VN is the more complicated carb with an automotive-type accelerator pump and economy valve. The VNN is the stripped down cheaper version that lacks both of those features.
I would have to look up close to see? I just went to the parts store and told the guy what I was looking for? He has been working behind the same counter for over 35 years, Lol I told him what I had and he instantly knew what it was, pulled up the #'s and ordered the kit. I never thought to see if it was a VN or VNN?
If your carb is just plain wore out -the do what the other guy did. Solex took over British Zenith and some Solex carbs used on Volkswagens are very similar. Carb on a Jeep is also close enough.
At this point, since I never had the carb off or apart, I have no clue what is going on with it. I will work on it this weekend and find out. I have done a lot of GM Quadrajet and Holly units, so this can't be any worse?:dunno:
 

· Registered
Joined
·
34 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I was researching and found a carburetor specialist-- contact Randy Farmer at Farmer's Service, Inc. in Leetonia, Ohio. He is an expert on the Zenith carb

I got one from him and it has a fuel regulator mounted on it (everything from him is bolt on brand new ),,He does his own fabricating and specializing ,,Thank You for the comments
 

· Registered
Joined
·
34 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 · (Edited)
New question,,,, any post i found was from a few years ago and nothing recent for the 3120 backhoe that was put on the 3414 loader that i have ,, my collar is getting alot of play in the splines ,,,,Does anybody know if the top splined collar is being made new or anyone can refabricate it anywhere ?
 

· Registered
Joined
·
46 Posts
New question,,,, any post i found was from a few years ago and nothing recent for the 3120 backhoe that was put on the 3414 loader that i have ,, my collar is getting alot of play in the splines ,,,,Does anybody know if the top splined collar is being made new or anyone can refabricate it anywhere ?
OK, Long story short about getting a new collar, NO WAY!!!!!!. I know your next question will be, "So how do I fix it?". There are various methods of rigging/repairing the collar and shaft. Some are much better IMHO than others? The first option is to try and weld the shaft to the collar. DO NOT DO THIS!!!!!! It will only work short term. Without a doubt, the welds will crack and break within the next 10 or 15 hours (if not sooner).

Another option is to try and find a used part that is still good and replace the cap. Since every hoe of this type has the same issue, chances are that even if you do find a parts machine, the cap/shaft is in the same or worse condition than the one you are trying to replace.

You could also have the shaft and cap spray welded. This will add to the thickness of the shaft and make a tighter fit. I would assume that this option is a lot of $$$ though?

The next method is to drive objects into the spline itself. The idea is that it tightens up everything and stops movement. I have heard about/seen pics of many different things stuck in there, Lol One unit had finishing nails driven into every space on every spline. The individual who did it claimed that it worked well? This doesn't seem like a great long term fix?

I have seen units with holes drilled between the shaft and the cap, straight down into the space between the two. These holes were then filled in with hex head cap screws. I have not tried this, but it does seem like a better option than nails and screws jammed into the spline? It would seem to me that the shaft itself would be a much harder steel than the cast cap? This tells me that as I am drilling the hole, the bit will work sideways into the softer steel. This would produce an oblong hole along with the entire length/depth of the hole ending up at an angle.

The next one is to drill a hole across the middle of the cap through the shaft and put a bolt through it. I am told this works well, but eventually, the hole becomes elongated and the bolt must be replaced. Over time, I would also think that because of the back and forth motions, the torque being applied to the left and right side of the bolt would enlarge the hole, facilitating the need to drill ever larger holes and use ever larger bolts to keep it tight?.

Last, but not least, I have been told that you can remove the cap, make a cut straight down the back side and then turn it sideways and drill a hole across the cut. Countersink both ends of the hole you drilled for a flat surface at each end and then put a bolt through the hole and re-install the cap. Once the shaft is in place, you simply use the cap as a clamp and tighten up the bolt. This draws the circumference of the hole down in size, tightening the cap around the shaft and eliminating play.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do!.:howdy:
 

· Registered
Joined
·
34 Posts
Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Thank You Superdog for your input, I really thought about a bead of weld and as you mentioned it will crack , I was a machinist for 16 years and the way i only seeing a way to make a new splined collar would be a wire EDM machine ,I am going to have to find some one local to see if they can copy one
 

· Registered
Joined
·
852 Posts
Thank You Superdog for your input, I really thought about a bead of weld and as you mentioned it will crack , I was a machinist for 16 years and the way i only seeing a way to make a new splined collar would be a wire EDM machine ,I am going to have to find some one local to see if they can copy one
There's been a used collar on Ebay for two weeks and it didn't look too bad.

I've seen many with holes drilled at every spline and pins driven in. My neighbor's 3120 hoe on his 3414 has been like that for 20 years and works well enough. Might not be a great fix for a pro machine that gets used everyday but certainly works OK for a private use machine.

I've already got a new collar and a good used one. Haven't used either yet on mine since it doesn't wobble too bad with a few nails in it.

Many other hoes like MF, Deere, and AC also have splines that wear with the barrel-swing-cylinder setup. Deere sold an epoxy kit to fix, made by Devcon. Basically you drill, pin, and glue with epoxy. If you ever have to take apart, you have to heat with a torch to break the bond. Deere even used the Devcon steel-based epoxy to fix loose splines on log skidder axles/hubs and it held amazingly well.
 

Attachments

· Registered
Joined
·
46 Posts
I still haven't figured out why my shaft is almost an inch lower than it should be? I have been using it to load top soil and I bought a Kubota with a hoe on it, so even though it is much smaller, it has done the job for me so far. Anyways, I was wondering if anyone has ever had that shaft off? is there bushings inside it that keeps the shaft up? If anyone has any insight as to what the problem may be?, I would LOVE to know!:thanku:
 

· Registered
Joined
·
852 Posts
Thanks jdemaris i traced the collar on Ebay , still deciding whether or not to purchase,,my machine is a good runner and it prob would be a good investment
Funny thing happened last light and it's not related to fixing your machine. We bought a bunch of the old Columbo TV movies on DVD - from the 60s-70s. On the episode we watched last night the police had to dig up a huge foundation of new building - looking for a body buried in concrete. Guess what machine they had? 3414 with a 3121 hoe on it. Looked and sounded like new - but I guess it was.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
46 Posts
Guess what machine they had? 3414 with a 3121 hoe on it. Looked and sounded like new - but I guess it was.
My guess is that somewhere out there, in a barn or shed is a perfect looking, hardly used 3414 with only a few scratches on it that still runs and works in a brand new condition. If I could only find it, Lol!
 

Attachments

1 - 17 of 17 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top