[FLHusqGT]

This is from a potential Husqvarna customer. The answer is an approved Husqvarna representative. They won't call their TS a Garden Tractor, they avoid it.

I would think calling the TS a Garden Tractor would build value for a potential sale.

If Husqvarna won't call their TS a Garden Tractor why would we call it a Garden Tractor?

This Tractor has not been available since 2018, here in FL, at Lowes, apparently indefinitely. The customers asking Lowes and Husqvarna for delivery dates do not get answered. You would think if Husqvarna cared so much about customer service, the Husqvarna Representative would have offered a different solution. But they don't.

 

[Steve Urquell]

Are you talking about where the rep calls it a mower? I feel that was proper in the context of the conversation.

Husqvarna is still calling the TS a GT on the website:

"Heavy duty garden tractor with unbeaten capabilities in its class. Commercial grade, extra fast ground-engaging transmission works with large, wide rear tyres to enable tough usage..."

https://www.husqvarna.com/us/products/riding-lawn-mowers/ts-354x/960430295/

 

[Ariens93GT20]

Still a glorified lawn tractor. The rep is correct regardless what Husqvarna wants to call it.

 

[TUDOR]

While the K66 hydro is a light duty GT transmission, it does need to be attached to a sufficiently strong frame to be used for GT applications over an extended period.

The TS frame falls a bit short for it to be called a GT for more than occasional use.

 

[ggsteve]

This is from a potential Husqvarna customer. The answer is an approved Husqvarna representative. They won't call their TS a Garden Tractor, they avoid it.
.

Just because in this well crafted answer the rep didn't mention that the TS model is a GT doesn't mean they won't if it were pertinent to the answer. The rep offered a better solution for steep grades as they should. You seem to have an agenda about Husqvarna. Fortunately, we have many choices of brands and models to choose from, hopefully enough to please everyone.

 

[Alien5044]

Re "customer service" comment. We think that there are Husqvarna, people with their firm's reputation at heart. Instead, customer service has become just a hired out cube farm of people looking to move their email in box to someone else, or close the ticket fast. This is how CS is rated. By the number of closed tickets and the duration. Your satisfaction likely has nothing to do with it. This is sad but seems to be the norm.

 

[FLHusqGT]

Re "customer service" comment. We think that there are Husqvarna, people with their firm's reputation at heart. Instead, customer service has become just a hired out cube farm of people looking to move their email in box to someone else, or close the ticket fast. This is how CS is rated. By the number of closed tickets and the duration. Your satisfaction likely has nothing to do with it. This is sad but seems to be the norm.

Wow, well said.

In fact, These answers are great!

Tudor, you get it!

Ariens93GT20, A Captain Obvious moment, Right?

ggsteve, You said,

"Just because in this well crafted answer the rep didn't mention that the TS model is a GT doesn't mean they won't if it were pertinent to the answer".

So if the question is pertinent to Garden Tractors, you are suggesting that Husqvarna will call the TS354D a Garden Tractor?

This is where I keep my word, my promise, and persistence.

I'm not so sure, The question had been raised, so I made the effort to document an attempt at getting a straight answer to a pertinent Garden Tractor question. This is what happened in the thread, "Will Husqvarna warranty use other than cutting grass for GT/ TS?" on The Official site for Husqvarna at the time. By the way Husqvarna later, sent emails out that the official Answer Army Site for Husqvarna was being shut down. It's still archived, along with other warranty bent, buckled, cracked frame issues.

I asked a simple question, they refused to answer ultimately, but deflected at first answering me with, "it's in our warranty". It's not. If it is, then it's worse for Husqvarna.

Take a look at that conversation attempt as documented in the thread.

You also said,

"You seem to have an agenda about Husqvarna."

If by agenda you mean, I'm keeping my word to warn and help people, how Husqvarna miss-represents their Garden Tractors, then I accept. I do offer solutions for people that want more out of their GT/ TS.

Husqvarna has an agenda to "abuse their customers", rather than honoring their warranty, they use miss-leading information to induce sales in a tractor that does not meet the industry standard for Garden Tractor.

You further said,

"Fortunately, we have many choices of brands and models to choose from, hopefully enough to please everyone. "

We completely agree at face value here. But,

If your Authorized Husqvarna Dealer, including Husqvarna Corporate, sell you a Garden Tractor with literature and sales aids to support promises of capability with specific implements discussed, offering further credibility through a warranty used to induce the sale, and it ends up being "smoke and mirrors" in the end, then it wasn't a choice. Simply put,

If you say your tractor is designed strong enough to have a snow blower attached to the front, then it should be strong enough to have a snow blower attached. For the purist's If you authorize through direct recommendation a specific implement, even sell it, and back up Husqvarna assurances with a warranty, then it is reasonable for a customer to think or believe the tractor is "capable".

Husqvarna likes to blame the customer, deflect, use public shame, then finally just ignore, but you won't get an honest response from them. When Companies believe themselves to be so big that they don't have to be accountable for their actions, it's time to warn, and hopefully they will clean up their act.... It could be a great value with honest representation.

From another perspective,

If I were able to write a check to the Husqvarna Dealer for $3,700 on a new TS354D, as an example, with the promise that the money was there, backing it up with very credible local sources that my Dealer knew, and a call to the bank with my bank assuring my Dealer, the check is good, and I pull a quick slip of funds while the new tractor was Delivered so I knowingly let the check go bouncy, bounce, Some people would actually say,

That's on the Dealer, ignoring all the credentials of local trust, or minimizing it. Regardless of the opinions, of who is right, or who is wrong......There's one truth that will prevail,......A local arrest for writing a bad check, and you will have to answer for, or be held accountable for your crime, and you should be.....


Why should Husqvarna get a pass?

And finally, Steve Urquell,

I too agreed with the rep Steve, in this instance he represented the product well, appropriately. It's rare, But it happens from time to time.

I do take exception for the lack of consideration on the customers behalf by recommending a tractor that can't be purchased at this time.

Can you find any evidence that the Hydra-Gear G730 is rated from Hydra-Gear as being rated for "ground engagement work" like Tuff Torq K66?

On the ad you linked......Yep, a Riding Lawn Tractor.

As an example, can you find on Simplicity's web page where they call their Prestige or Legacy a "Riding Lawn Tractor"?

Simplicity gives a choice up front, "Garden Tractors" & "Lawn Tractors". They don't mix the two classifications. If you look at the Prestige. Do they represent the tractor appropriately? Would you think it's "capable" of reliably performing as Simplicity represents?

Let's look at it from another angle,

Does John Deere specifically identify which class of tractors are "capable" of attaching and using implements (HDGT= Heavy Duty Garden Tractor)?

Husqvarna does indicate what tractors specifically their implements are for,

"All Husqvarna Tractors". Really? So let's see a few examples of what would normally be considered Garden Tractor attachments, to be used on a tractor rated for "ground engagement work".

Notice its for lawn tractors with 22" or 23" wheels as the only qualification for attachments that are "ground engaging"? Any Husqvarna lawn tractors with a 22" wheel and no-K66?

Or for the owner of a LT (lawn tractor) that needs to improve his traction with ground engaging attachments, 62lbs wheel weights driven by the very "heavy Duty" K46!!!!!! Right, the K46 is not rated anywhere near ground engagement capable, and has a 3/4" axle with much smaller weight limitations.

The front scoop that fits "all 2006 and all newer model year Husqvarna tractors"?????? Husqvarna makes it too easy for this.

This is a great example of miss-representation.... "fits all tex-style tractor frames (2006 and newer). Husqvarna calls their 26lbs, 12gauge, pressed steel, pan style chassis commonly used now on their GT/ TS a tex-style chassis.

So if you own a 2006 YT1942T #96043000300 Then this Snowblower is for you!

This ground engagement blade is also for "all Husqvarna tractors". Again think K46 here. The irony is that if it were used on the channel weld-ment chassis, common on Husqvarna YT's with K46 , the YT structurally, would be strong enough verses the TS.

:tango_face_wink:

Beware of Husqvarna Garden Tractors!

Cheers,

 

[BoWoggie]

The title of this thread got me curious about the age old question. What is an LT and what is a GT. I went looking on John Deeres site. They call ALL of their tractors Lawn tractors or lawn mowers. I didn't see anywhere where they referred to any of their tractors as GARDEN tractors. I am not saying it isn't there some place, but I didn't see it.

 

[Steve Urquell]

The title of this thread got me curious about the age old question. What is an LT and what is a GT. I went looking on John Deeres site. They call ALL of their tractors Lawn tractors or lawn mowers. I didn't see anywhere where they referred to any of their tractors as GARDEN tractors. I am not saying it isn't there some place, but I didn't see it.

Ha! That argument will drive you crazy as there is no set-in-stone definition and many will define it based on the equipment they personally own. The last thread discussing that devolved into "Nothing but a SCUT is a GT" It was strange and I just showed myself to the door before I became too irritated. :tango_face_grin:

Here's my OPINION on new GTs: No new GT is gonna be like the old GTs. For new GTs I look at the weight of the machine and the hydrostat. The Husqvarna has the hydrostat of a light GT but the weight of a lawn tractor. I wish that all new GTs could be like the heyday of older heavy GTs but that day is gone and the closest thing to that nowadays is the JD X700 series and Simplicity Legacy series. Cost on those is so close to SCUT territory I'd rather buy the SCUT and have a PTO if I needed that much more power.

For a MOWER for bigger properties, the TS Husqvarna is a good deal. If you want a GT, buy something older with more weight and steel in it.

 

[FLHusqGT]

The title of this thread got me curious about the age old question. What is an LT and what is a GT. I went looking on John Deeres site. They call ALL of their tractors Lawn tractors or lawn mowers. I didn't see anywhere where they referred to any of their tractors as GARDEN tractors. I am not saying it isn't there some place, but I didn't see it.

Yeah, John Deere is a little tricky now too, That's why I spoke of looking at the attachment side for what they are specific about with what tractor. Such as,

and,

As a few examples. HDGTs are all X700's and select X400 and X500's. (I think the 4x4 version X400 and X500, and oddly an X300 was 4X4 too, I think?).

HDGTs are Heavy Duty Garden Tractors. Notice that the attachments are for very specific models though, and the ground engagement attachments are only for Tractors that are specified, not a blanket "all" tractors.

A John Deere E100 or L100 (the cheapest grass cutter they build) has a stronger chassis than the Husqvarna TS354D.

This is the Husqvarna heavy duty TS chassis;

The tractor shovel or other ground engagement implements are not recommended by JD for the E100.. Husqvarna will claim all is game.

This is another way of demonstrating how Husqvarna miss-represents their product.

Just in case this is missed,

The standard definition for a Garden Tractor in the US is,

"Garden Tractors are designed to supply sufficient power for home lawn, garden
and yard attachments: moldboard plows, tillers, cultivators, snow throwers,
sweepers, leaf mulchers, etc. Fifty percent of garden tractors are used for areas
larger than two acres."

The authority on defining what a Garden Tractor is, comes from OPEI. Outdoor Power Equipment Institute, of which Husqvarna is a participating member.

Cheers,

 

[TUDOR]

The title of this thread got me curious about the age old question. What is an LT and what is a GT. I went looking on John Deeres site. They call ALL of their tractors Lawn tractors or lawn mowers. I didn't see anywhere where they referred to any of their tractors as GARDEN tractors. I am not saying it isn't there some place, but I didn't see it.

Basically, weight differentiates between the two. LTs weigh 400-600 lb with the mower deck. GTs weigh 500 lb and up without the deck. That is a general statement. As with all general statements, there is some flexibility.

Generally (there's that word again), the primary duty of LTs and GTs is to mow lawns. That's how they are equipped when the manufacturers ship them, and why most customers buy them.

Defining the difference between entry level, light, medium, and heavy GTs is somewhat more difficult, although the entry level GT can be more accurately described as an LT with an attitude problem. Like the model under discussion, it only thinks that it's a GT.

The modern SCUT can be described as a heavy GT with an attitude, but not an attitude problem.

 

[ggsteve]

The modern SCUT can be described as a heavy GT with an attitude, but not an attitude problem.

Well this certainly puts the LT/GT discussion to bed! Tudor, I take everything you post as gospel, but I am forced to admit that I have no idea what this means.:hide:

 

[FLHusqGT]

Basically, weight differentiates between the two. LTs weigh 400-600 lb with the mower deck. GTs weigh 500 lb and up without the deck. That is a general statement. As with all general statements, there is some flexibility.

Generally (there's that word again), the primary duty of LTs and GTs is to mow lawns. That's how they are equipped when the manufacturers ship them, and why most customers buy them.

Defining the difference between entry level, light, medium, and heavy GTs is somewhat more difficult, although the entry level GT can be more accurately described as an LT with an attitude problem. Like the model under discussion, it only thinks that it's a GT.

The modern SCUT can be described as a heavy GT with an attitude, but not an attitude problem.

I like that description,

"the entry level GT can be more accurately described as an LT with an attitude problem."

My comment about weight might not be getting communicated very well? Not the first time.

I point out the weight to offer some "grounding" in an argument I have about the absurd representation of the TS/ GT frame by Husqvarna and those that don't want to be confused with the facts.

Simply put, more steel, more strength, generally. (Now I just used that word:tango_face_smile

Every time you put a hole in flat steel, it looses some strength. But every crease will increase strength.

A piece of 1/4" flat bar that is 3'' wide by say 60" long will be weaker than the same steel of same dimension called angle, and angle of same will be weaker than channel, and channel weaker than tube.

I was only demonstrating the origins of the TS/ GT chassis in design within the same manufacturer, and if Husqvarna built a chassis for their cheapest lawn tractor, it is not logical for that same design to be put in a tractor they represent as being capable of more than cutting grass, and actually infer through advertising that its somehow stronger.

another example,

A chassis design for the Chevy 1500 p/u (1/2 ton) would not make logical sense in their 3500 p/u with dually's and rated 1 ton plus. I like both trucks, they both are very useful, but the 1500 is built more for ride comfort, and the 3500 from underneath is more like farm equipment. They are vastly different.

Husqvarna took the 1500 (grass cutter) and decided to put a bigger motor and transaxle on it and re-badged it as a 3500 (the TS/ GT). I don't have a problem with people being sold a fantasy if that's what they want. I do have a problem with the fantasy being sold as something real.

If Husqvarna were to use their channel chassis that is in their yard tractor (the stronger built chassis by Husqvarna) on their TS354D then it would transform that tractor to a true light duty GT, and they would now be properly representing their product.
No extra cost, and it is already recognized as stronger. A real bargain.

The next thing I would ask of them,

If you offer a warranty, keep your word and honor it, in accordance with how you represent your product. If Husqvarna wants to still play games with the worthless warranty they offer, than be up front and don't offer one. The way it is now, flat unethical, I have the written proof of that.

I like your insights Tudor

Cheers

:tango_face_wink:

 

[FLHusqGT]

Well this certainly puts the LT/GT discussion to bed! Tudor, I take everything you post as gospel, but I am forced to admit that I have no idea what this means.:hide:

Let me help you ggsteve,

The little emoji is hiding behind something.

Just like Husqvarna, My challenge to Husqvarna is now over 1 year old, I can't blame them, I am still holding on to their written words that are not defensible.

cheers

 

[TUDOR]

Well this certainly puts the LT/GT discussion to bed! Tudor, I take everything you post as gospel, but I am forced to admit that I have no idea what this means.:hide:

How about " A SCUT is a GT on steroids"?

Even that loses something in the translation. My heavy tractors are primarily snow movers. My 2wd GT with chains will outperform my 4wd SCUT without chains any day of the week doing that job.

 

[Herbl]

Not to beat this to death but John Deere on their own website calls their X300, X500, X700 tractors "Lawn Tractors and or Lawn Mowers" just thought I'd let you know about what manufacturers call the equipment.

https://www.deere.com/en/mowers/lawn...s/x700-series/

Just thought this might be of interest.

 

[Sergeant]

Not to beat this to death but John Deere on their own website calls their X300, X500, X700 tractors "Lawn Tractors and or Lawn Mowers" just thought I'd let you know about what manufacturers call the equipment.

https://www.deere.com/en/mowers/lawn...s/x700-series/

Just thought this might be of interest.

I'll refer you to page 5 post 67 https://www.mytractorforum.com/64-h...s-part-4-front-scoop-capable-5.html:thThumbsU

 

[Sergeant]

How about " A SCUT is a GT on steroids"?

Even that loses something in the translation. My heavy tractors are primarily snow movers. My 2wd GT with chains will outperform my 4wd SCUT without chains any day of the week doing that job.

New Holland and Massey Ferguson treat there SCUT's as Garden tractors on Steroids :thThumbsU

 

[FLHusqGT]

Ha! That argument will drive you crazy as there is no set-in-stone definition and many will define it based on the equipment they personally own. The last thread discussing that devolved into "Nothing but a SCUT is a GT" It was strange and I just showed myself to the door before I became too irritated. :tango_face_grin:

Here's my OPINION on new GTs: No new GT is gonna be like the old GTs. For new GTs I look at the weight of the machine and the hydrostat. The Husqvarna has the hydrostat of a light GT but the weight of a lawn tractor. I wish that all new GTs could be like the heyday of older heavy GTs but that day is gone and the closest thing to that nowadays is the JD X700 series and Simplicity Legacy series. Cost on those is so close to SCUT territory I'd rather buy the SCUT and have a PTO if I needed that much more power.

For a MOWER for bigger properties, the TS Husqvarna is a good deal. If you want a GT, buy something older with more weight and steel in it.

Thank You!!!!!

You get it, Husqvarna miss-represents their product.

And, as for your opinion, I respect that, especially when it's given as such, up front. That's the whole stance (just be up front or properly represent your product) I promised Husqvarna I would take when "they" chose to not honor my warranty with their written lies, I confronted them with. (I told them "I'm left with no other choice but to warn people as much as I can" to beware (be aware) of Husqvarna Garden Tractors and their worthless warranty).

(all I've asked since then from Husqvarna, a public apology to my Wife and I, and to properly represent their product, if that's tooo hard for them, at least publicly debate my accusations, and their written statement of reasons for warranty denial, and my evidence, out in the open, a year ago. Husqvarna's response.....yeah, that's too hard for them too. I'm keeping my word)

About the definition.....

The manufacturing secter has specific rules in order to be in compliance. I have many credentialed places I can point to that are regulated by our Government and by themselves through agreements, but this is enough, for now.

It's really as simple as starting right here,

1) Is there an official organization that is responsible for defining and compliance of safety, and for what?

YES! Even John Deere advertises openly in their compliance with OPEI.

Outdoor Power Equipment Institute. OPEI.

2) If it matters to the manufacturers, then it should probably matter to the customer.

3) Who within this organization creates the definition for US manufacturing compliance?

The list of manufacturers are in the pdf I supplied and look in particular to......Husqvarna. Yep, they are on the list of contributing manufacturer members. Also, it would be illegal for Husqvarna to sell one tractor out of compliance with OPEI, so how do they skirt the definition and compliance part? Ever notice what the TS354D is listed as by category of tractor? Yeah..."Riding Lawn Mower" and their warranty has zero allowance for using Garden Tractor implements, all other use is denied by abuse or modification clauses (and others), and has zero classification for Garden Tractor, in the warranty they are Ridding Lawn Mowers only, again in compliance with OPEI. I think the answer is somewhere in here.

But, remember, OPEI defines Garden Tractor with it's own definition! Husqvarna miss-represents their Garden Tractor for many other reason's, too include their unwaivering support for their unethical Dealers. (there are ethical one's too)

When a person buys a Chevy 3500 (1 ton+ classification) the customer can look up what the official standards for manufacture are and have a reasonable expectation that it will safely and competently haul 1 ton as it's payload. When it doesn't in accordance with the warranty period, the customer has a reasonable expectation that the warranty will be honored when their truck failed while using it in compliance with industry standards and the manufacturing standards, clearly defined. It's tooo easy.:tango_face_smile:

Also, this definition has become stronger or more clear since 1979, maybe earlier, but I'm not listing a fact without holding the proof, as for me, opinions cost too much, and so, don't work for me, only proof. The definition with engineering standards is what the machine should be "capable" of, not opinion. That's the reason for the title, so as to keep it in line with the official definition. These aren't my words, and the evidence of OPEI's importance for manufacturing compliance is numerous, just look.

The ASABE has responsibility for engineering standards and force specifics for implements and the Garden Tractor (or Lawn Tractor). OPEI is responsible for the definition of Lawn or Garden Tractor, and the agreement for compliance of engineering standards according to their definition and the safety equipment for compliance.

There is a Lawn Tractor according to official standards. Fact.

There is a Garden Tractor according to official standards. Fact.

There is "no" defined official standards for, Light Garden Tractor (LGT), Yard Tractor (YT), or any other combination of marketing strategies. These categories are completely up to the manufacturer, to mean whatever they want. Fact.

It would not surprise me in the slightest if Husqvarna would not be interested in their customers knowing there are actual industry standards. Don't worry, I have been doing my homework as promised, so I can make people "aware" of when they are being fleeced with or how at least, then it's up to them, at least they will have actual facts to be able to make their purchasing decision for themselves.

A copy is given to those that want the whole definition.

There have always been groups of people, ok with just belief. Right?

:tango_face_smile:

I've offered actual evidence. More than I can say for other's.

 

[FLHusqGT]

New Holland and Massey Ferguson treat there SCUT's as Garden tractors on Steroids :thThumbsU

I like them, want one, maybe someday.....:tango_face_wink:

Nice to hear from you Sergeant.