My Tractor Forum banner

1 - 15 of 15 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
119 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
A few questions for those of you with more experience than I:

I have a 1978 446.

1. I would like to look into getting a new style holding valve for the tractor as there is a possibility in the future I will be mowing a fairly steep hillside at church. While I think Jesus would be on my side I prefer not to meet him in person quite yet. I understand that there are multiple valves (M and L maybe) based upon the age of the tractor. Which do I need and how can I tell them apart?

I just picked up a 38" Snowcaster today and have it hooked up to my 446.

2. The blower tracks just a smidge inside of the tire line. I am planning to make some wings for it just to make it a bit wider. Any advice on where to mount them or how much bigger that the tractor line it should be?

3. The chute on the blower turns pretty hard and binds when turning to the left. If I knock it around while turning the lever it will rotate though. Any suggestions on adjustment or lube of the chute to make this more useable?

Thanks!
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
1,634 Posts
[QUOTE

I just picked up a 38" Snowcaster today and have it hooked up to my 446.

2. The blower tracks just a smidge inside of the tire line. I am planning to make some wings for it just to make it a bit wider. Any advice on where to mount them or how much bigger that the tractor line it should be?
![/QUOTE]

Obviously the "smidge" will increase when turning. The factory "wings" take the width from 38" to 42" I just ordered a set(SB series snowcaster) from [email protected] for $48
 

·
Ingersoll Dealer
Joined
·
2,552 Posts
I'll hold off replying on the valve, as I don't have clear reference information in front of me right now.

Make the wings at least 2" outward on each side, like the later model SB42 snowcasters which were meant to go with the 4000 series tractors. I recommend going 3" each side, to be truthful.

Make them out of really steady stock ... as thick as the snowcaster housing. Your housing may already have mounting holes along the front vertical edges for this.

As for the rotator, I would check to see if there is a bit of a weld bead or weld slag that is getting caught up in the chute serations. I've seen a few stubborn ones which became perfectly cooperative when a rough spot on the coil was ground smooth.

Brian
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
1,500 Posts
The wings are made in a double offset that is bent at 45 degrees. In other words, they bolt onto the sides of the snow caster, head 45 degrees outward from either side and then return at 45 degrees so that they are in-line with the side plates/end plates of the snow caster. The offset is 2 inches per side to widen the cut to 42".

If you want a new-style holding valve, then that's a holding valve that is built into the travel/lift valve. Those are found on tractors made in 1986 or later and get sold on e-bay for around $200.00 and up lately. They can be retro-fitted onto the older tractors by drilling two new mounting holes in your tractors check plate floor about 5/8" or so back from the current holes. With some gentle massaging, your old steel lines can be used.

I'm betting that your snowcaster is a rusty mess. If so, it won't perform for you so you may as well take it totally apart, pay someone to media blast it down to clean, bare metal and then give it multiple coats of fresh enamel with a hardener in it. Rust on the housing, auger and chute all impede snow badly.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
1,044 Posts
There are two kinds to my knowledge.

On is an add on kit, that has three or four short steel lines and a box looking valve. Pretty easy to recognize.

There is on the is built into the TCV body. Not easy for me to tell the difference from one that has it and doesn't. Not all auction sellers list it in the description but I am a sure a few that have it slipped through and gone for cheap cause guys like me can't tell the difference.

I am working on a deal for the kit one myself from another enthusiast.

I agree that it is pretty much needed luxury item unless you live on really flat land somewhere on the prarie. There is always a hill around here taunting me, bet there are a few around everyone else too.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
670 Posts
So is there only one type of valve?
There are two "types". One is built into the travel control valve and one is a separate add on valve.

There are several different versions of the add on valve.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
1,044 Posts
Sorry Snot, I meant types, thanks for the clarification.

I am not sure which model kit valve I am trying to buy, I have not seen a picture of it yet, it is still in place.

The kits I have seen so far have all looked pretty much similar. The "box" and four steel lines variety. Are there others? I saw a diagram exploded view one time of both kinds that I know of but I can't remember where. (maybe I dreamed it...lol anyone else dream CASE??!!??) I would like to see an example if anyone has one. Thank you.

I need a lesson on how to spot a TCV with holding option just by looking. Anyone?

I am not sure I will be able to purchase this one yet, I am giving the gentleman some time to decide.

so I might need to know for the next one I find.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
1,500 Posts
The standard travel/lift valve looks like this.




The travel/lift/HOLDING valve looks like this. Do you see the raised portion over top the travel half of the valve? That's where the "holding" bits and pieces reside. This style of valve started to show up as standard equipment on some models as early as the 1985 production year but by the time the 1986's hit the dealer's lot, all of the Hydriv garden tractors were equipped with them. That extra port on the side of this valve is for the case drain line that was needed for attachments equipped with motors that had the case drain feature. Just put a plug into that port. Do not use it as a case drain even if you decide to put one one your tractor. That was a mistake.




Previously, if you wanted a holding valve it was an option and it came in the form of a KIT. I want everyone to understand that the term KIT means that when you bought this item, you received a cardboard box that not only contained the cast iron holding valve but it also contained the double-ended hydraulic fitting you see in the diagram below and the THREE (not four) custom bent steel hydraulic lines that are needed to hook it up.

I say this because I've seen e-bay listings by stupid vendors who were offering just the valve and not the lines. DO NOT BUY A VALVE THAT DOES NOT COME WITH THE LINES AND FITTING. You cannot buy the lines from Ingersoll any longer. You will end up with a valve that will become a plumbing nightmare to hook up. Secondly, you need to watch out for the correct valve that has lines suited to the wheelbase of your tractor.

All 200 series tractors have a 46" wheelbase, as do all 400 series tractors prior to a certain serial number change that happened in 1979 when the wheelbase became 48". If in doubt, then measure the distance along the check plate floor between the pedestal your seat sits on and the pedestal the dashboard sits on. Short wheelbase tractors measure 13" and long wheelbase tractors measure 15". If you see a kit for sale, ask the Seller for the model and serial number of the tractor the kit was removed from.

Getting a kit with the wrong steel lines is almost as bad as buying one with no lines. Don't make this costly mistake. Be 100 percent sure what that kit is before you part with your cash.





This valve is easy to install. You jack up the rear of the tractor and place it on proper stands. Remove the left rear wheel. Remove the two steel hydraulic lines that attach the drive motor to the travel valve ports. The short fitting on the holding valve then screws directly onto one motor port and the steel tube that does the 180 screws onto the other motor port. The other two tubes attach to the travel valve ports. Only AFTER you have all four installed with your fingers doing the turning of the nuts do you use wrenches to tighten them until snug.

CLEANLINESS IS PARAMOUNT. Every line and fitting should be washed in clean solvent inside and out before doing this procedure. Pretend that you are a surgeon conducting a heart transplant. The tiniest bit of dirt can cause you untold grief if it lodges in one of the pilot ports inside the holding valve. So, the parts need to be clean, your tools need to be clean and your hands need to be clean. The existing travel valve and drive motor should be clean as well.

EDIT:

The L-7 kit was used on the 200 series tractors

The L-9 kit was used on the 400 series tractors

The LL-9 kit was used on the 600 series tractors

The M-9 and N-9 kits were used on the long wheelbase 400 series tractors

The valve bodies pretty much look the same. The difference is in the length and bend of the tubes so that they fit properly. Keep in mind that all three series used drive motors of different internal displacements. Therefore the placement of the ports changed because the external dimensions of these motors were different too.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
1,044 Posts
Thank you VERY much Castoff !!!

I understand now what it is that I need to be looking at.

Most appreciated, might want to sticky this.

still unclear about the variety of kits mentioned before. I have only seen ones like the one above.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
119 Posts
Discussion Starter · #14 ·
I have a shot at buying a holding valve from an Ingersoll tractor rather than the Case. The guy said one fitting is different but I can use my existing fitting in its place.

Is there any reason a 4000 Ingersoll Valve wouldn't work on a 400 Series Case tractor?

I will be getting some pics later too.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
1,500 Posts
If someone is parting out a 4000 series Ingy, then you will be buying a travel/lift valve that has the holding valve feature built into it. See the photos I posted. I have no idea what that guy is talking about regarding the fitting but try and get the two steel lines from him that connect that valve to the drive motor. The valve will fit your tractor but you may have to drill two new mounting holes to bolt it onto your tractor.
 
1 - 15 of 15 Posts
Top