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Bolens G16YT aka 2016G
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Alone the ruff and rugged road toward restoring my Bolens 2016 (G16YT) I have gotten to this little bugger. I've been working on my wiring, charging system, head light power, etc.

Now, in my limited research I've seen this thing called a Fuel Shut Off Soleniod, Anti-Backfire plug, and Electronic Fuel Shut Off Valve.

I gather that there is a rod/plunger inside here that when you shut off the ignition the plug moves forward and stops any further gas from entering the cylinder.

Couple of purposes would be to stop gas from being discharged into the muffler chamber, after the Magneto stops sending power to the spark plugs, eliminating BACKFIRE...

Another would be safety reasons...

B&S tells me that backfile won't hurt anything other than your pride when everyone hears a big BANG coming from your tractor...

I hate the backfire, but there is also something about having a prefectly good device just sitting there disconnected...

Now, what do I do to make this thing function properly?:confused: without...:14_6_5:

I'm thinking that the wire running to my Magneto/Ignition Coil is the way to go. It's already running right past this fuel shut off and I could just split off that wire to this thing...:Stop::Stop::Stop: Or maybe not...:praying:

I was also thinking that the ign. swith post running to the Solenoid might be the one that should be used as I have seen this called a Solenoid...:banghead3

Or, most likely I'm off track with both ideas...:fing20:

Any, help here would be appreciated...:thanku:
 

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"purposes would be to stop gas from being discharged into the muffler chamber, after the Magneto stops sending power to the spark plugs, eliminating BACKFIRE..."

Not that it maters but the correct term is "after fire" backfire is something else.

"Now, what do I do to make this thing function properly? without..."

It needs 12 V to it when the ignition switch is in START and ON. To run without, cut off plunger, wedge it in retracted position, replace with plug made for the purpose, then allow engine to run at idle for 30 seconds before shutting off, shut off at wide open throttle or shut off manual gas line shut off valve allowing engine to run out of gas. IF you don't have a manual in line shut off valve, you should install one IF the gas tank is above the inlet to the carb. and use it when the engine is not running.

"I'm thinking that the wire running to my Magneto/Ignition Coil is the way to go."

Absolutely not. As I said, that solenoid needs 12 V to it to start and run. The last thing you want to do is introduce any battery current to your ignition system as it is totally self contained magneto system which would then be ruined. Connecting directly to that would short out the ignition system serving as a "Kill Wire" anyway.

"I was also thinking that the ign. swith post running to the Solenoid might be the one that should be used as I have seen this called a Solenoid..."

Again NO, that only supplies 12 V when starting and you need it while running also. The solenoid that wire runs to is the starter solenoid. What you are talking about is the "after fire solenoid"

Connect to a post on ignition switch which is hot when the switch is in ON and START positions. MAY require you to install a different switch to obtain this.

Walt Conner
 

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...

I hate the backfire, but there is also something about having a prefectly good device just sitting there disconnected...
...
Let's see...magneto kill wire connected to nothing and you can still shut the engine off with the key switch AND a "perfectly functioning" anti-afterfire solenoid not even connected and the engine still runs!!! :eek:

You have a magic tractor. Are you sure it even needs gas in the tank to run? :ROF :hide:
 

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Bolens G16YT aka 2016G
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
"purposes would be to stop gas from being discharged into the muffler chamber, after the Magneto stops sending power to the spark plugs, eliminating BACKFIRE..."

Not that it maters but the correct term is "after fire" backfire is something else.

"Now, what do I do to make this thing function properly? without..."

It needs 12 V to it when the ignition switch is in START and ON. To run without, cut off plunger, wedge it in retracted position, replace with plug made for the purpose, then allow engine to run at idle for 30 seconds before shutting off, shut off at wide open throttle or shut off manual gas line shut off valve allowing engine to run out of gas. IF you don't have a manual in line shut off valve, you should install one IF the gas tank is above the inlet to the carb. and use it when the engine is not running.

"I'm thinking that the wire running to my Magneto/Ignition Coil is the way to go."

Absolutely not. As I said, that solenoid needs 12 V to it to start and run. The last thing you want to do is introduce any battery current to your ignition system as it is totally self contained magneto system which would then be ruined. Connecting directly to that would short out the ignition system serving as a "Kill Wire" anyway.

"I was also thinking that the ign. swith post running to the Solenoid might be the one that should be used as I have seen this called a Solenoid..."

Again NO, that only supplies 12 V when starting and you need it while running also. The solenoid that wire runs to is the starter solenoid. What you are talking about is the "after fire solenoid"

Connect to a post on ignition switch which is hot when the switch is in ON and START positions. MAY require you to install a different switch to obtain this.

Walt Conner
Hey Walt;
The term afterfire makes more sense and I appreciate learning correct terminology...:thanku:

I would not hook up anything without a definative answer. I'm not the type to say "Hey, lets try this and see what happens"...:fing20:

And, I figured that any ideas I had would likely not be the answer as my knowledge about engine electrical wiring is limited...

I can determine what posts in the ign. sw. will do what you suggested. I also, have seen where the 5 post ign. sw. on my tractor was replaced with a 6 post...I'll look into how I can use my sw. or getting another...

Here's a copy of my wiring diagram and now that I've read your comments that "L" post might be a possibility...?...:hatsoff:

The diagram differs in that my current system is a dual circuit and it is showing a tri-circuit. The ign. sw. wiring is the same...

Any thoughts...:thanku:
 

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Bolens G16YT aka 2016G
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Let's see...magneto kill wire connected to nothing and you can still shut the engine off with the key switch AND a "perfectly functioning" anti-afterfire solenoid not even connected and the engine still runs!!! :eek:

You have a magic tractor. Are you sure it even needs gas in the tank to run? :ROF :hide:
If I knew as much as you about all this I'm sure I'd be confused also, but sometimes not knowing is less stressfull...:trink39:

Maybe I should consider myself lucky my battery gets power and headlights work and just live with the afterfire...:lalala:

I just got in some wiring harness quick connect's and plan on replacing every wire in the tractor. I figured now would be a good time to incorporate the fuel shutoff capability...:praying:
 

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Doesn't appear that the wiring diagram makes any allowances for the carb solenoid. Take a meter and test for 12v from the various connections on the ignition switch. You want a pole that has 12v when in the "ON" position as well as the "START" position.
 

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10K and Climbin!
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Say, I was just reading your other post about the multi-meter use. You have an attachment in there with switch information. Depending on which switch you have on your tractor, you can tell which post to run the wire for the solenoid. You want one that is "hot" when in the run and start position.

http://www.mytractorforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=118167&d=1282745331
Find the hot wire @ the ign on the coil and splice it and run it over to your soleniod.. Just my 20cents..
 

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There is no hot wire to the coil, why not just put a plug in it? All the twins iv seen just use a plug, maybe order one for an older model? Just a suggestion.
 

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Bolens G16YT aka 2016G
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I think the general thinking, across the board, is the easiest way to go is not to use the solenoid, as Walt suggested.

I checked my 2 other twins and one had a bolt with the exposed end wrapped in electrical tape and the other has an unknown plug...:fing20:

Anyway, I still want to try and hook it and use it for awhile...

My voltmeter is on "L" and as Brad suggested it does come on when I turn the switch on and stays on after starting and while running. Turn the key off and the voltmeter goes off...

I'm going to check it with my meter, but think that it will be the one...

First, I'm going to pull that solenoid out and experiment with it outside the fuel pump. It's likely not been used in so long I could just lock it open on first use...

From my limited understanding the small plunger retracts when the power is ON and then stays retracted while the engine runs and as soon as the switch is turned OFF it moves forward pluging the flow of gas...:fing32:

I don't know if I can get to it today, but by tomorrow I should know more...Watch for a bright glow in the sky over S.E. Michigan...:Stop:
 

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I'm with Walt,If you don't have a problem with afterfire don't mess with it.And I second the shut off on the fuel, it can't hurt.
 

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I would bet that your shutoff has been 'modified' already, or the plunger is jammed into the retracted position. You may have to buy another if your plunger has been cut shorter to defeat the solenoid. If it is just jammed into the retracted position, you may be able to unjam it. I've read 'somewhere' that a 9-volt battery should be sufficient to energize and operate a fuel cutoff solenoid. As noted they do not totally cut off the fuel as an in-line shutoff valve would do, but slow the flow enough to starve the engine from running-on after you turn the key to off.
tom
 

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So the engine runs fine with it? Why not just leave it? It probably already has the shaft to the plunger cut off.
 

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Bolens G16YT aka 2016G
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Discussion Starter · #14 · (Edited)
Walt, Brad, gmaster,dc 3mech,tomw0 you are all correct in your comments. I have been continuing my research and inquiries and found both pro's and con's to using or not using the Fuel Shut Off Solenoid.

If working and used properly it has a few benefits like stopping fuel from running into your cylinder/crankcase if the float sticks, eliminating after fire, and being a cool little 80 dollar electronic part that I already own...:thThumbsU

Drawbacks are it's another electric part to break, another wire to run, there are other cheaper easier ways to accomplish the same thing...:banghead3

Sticking a bolt in the hole would not be a way for me to go...strip the threads, improperly seal the plug, screw it in too far, torque it too much, etc., etc., and you have a new and possibly bigger problem...:lalala:

There actually is an OEM part to go in that place and it's called a "Jet Main (Fixed) (High Speed) aka (High Altitude). It's made by Briggs for that purpose...

I've decided to order the Jet Main and use it along with installing a manual shut off valve, which, I thought was a brilliant and super simple idea.

Great for any carb work you might want to do without having to remove and drain the line...:trink39:

When I finish mowing I will just idle down the engine, turn the shut off valve and after the engine shuts down, turn the key off.

Then I have a clean and empty carb and fuel pump...:fing32:

I'll pull the electric soleniod off, inspect, clean, and sell it as used on ebay for 40 bucks...:drunkie:

You guys shoving bolts in there might want to check for an OEM part to go in there...They are like 3 to 6 dollars for mine depending where you order from...:trink39:

Thanks to all of and I think this one can be put to bed...:congrats:
 

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walt, brad, gmaster,dc 3mech,tomw0 you are all correct in your comments. I have been continuing my research and inquiries and found both pro's and con's to using or not using the fuel shut off solenoid.
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if working and used properly it has a few benefits like stopping fuel from running into your cylinder/crankcase if the float sticks, eliminating after fire, and being a cool little 80 dollar electronic part that i already own...:ththumbsu
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the above is certainly not true for walbro carbs used on briggs. The solenoid just stops fuel from getting from bowl to jet/nozzle. They will still flood if needle sticks
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drawbacks are it's another electric part to break, another wire to run, there are other cheaper easier ways to accomplish the same thing...:banghead3

sticking a bolt in the hole would not be a way for me to go...strip the threads, improperly seal the plug, screw it in too far, torque it too much, etc., etc., and you have a new and possibly bigger problem...:lalala:

There actually is an oem part to go in that place and it's called a "jet main (fixed) (high speed) aka (high altitude). It's made by briggs for that purpose...

I've decided to order the jet main and use it along with installing a manual shut off valve, which, i thought was a brilliant and super simple idea.

Great for any carb work you might want to do without having to remove and drain the line...:trink39:

When i finish mowing i will just idle down the engine, turn the shut off valve and after the engine shuts down, turn the key off.

Then i have a clean and empty carb and fuel pump...:fing32:

I'll pull the electric soleniod off, inspect, clean, and sell it as used on ebay for 40 bucks...:drunkie:

You guys shoving bolts in there might want to check for an oem part to go in there...they are like 3 to 6 dollars for mine depending where you order from...:trink39:

Thanks to all of and i think this one can be put to bed...:congrats:
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My B&S powered swisher trail mower has both, manual shut off at the tank and solenoid at the eng. Belt and suspenders.
 

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"shoving bolts in there"
lol got told that by briggs,
had a murray, the solenoid was on the bottom also acting as a bowl nut,
they told me just replace with a reg screw,&do the inline shut off deal too
 

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Belt and suspenders it may be called, but I don't think the solenoid valves cut off the fuel flow completely. I have one out back on a Briggs 14.5 that now has a dipstick showing about twice normal oil level in the crankcase, and an empty fuel tank.
Shoulda put in a shutoff when I replaced the fuel line, but didn't. Live and learn. My learning says if you want a shutoff, put one in.
tom

p.s. the "it's called a "Jet Main (Fixed) (High Speed) aka (High Altitude). It's made by Briggs for that purpose..." is internal to the carburetor. What you want to order is the "Fixed main jet cover", not the "jet" itself.
tom
 

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Bolens G16YT aka 2016G
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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Belt and suspenders it may be called, but I don't think the solenoid valves cut off the fuel flow completely. I have one out back on a Briggs 14.5 that now has a dipstick showing about twice normal oil level in the crankcase, and an empty fuel tank.
Shoulda put in a shutoff when I replaced the fuel line, but didn't. Live and learn. My learning says if you want a shutoff, put one in.
tom

p.s. the "it's called a "Jet Main (Fixed) (High Speed) aka (High Altitude). It's made by Briggs for that purpose..." is internal to the carburetor. What you want to order is the "Fixed main jet cover", not the "jet" itself.
tom
I have installed an in-line shut-off valve. Takes a moment or two for it to shut off, but that's no big deal. Does stop the after-fire.

You hit the nail on the head with that jet-main being internal. I have found and ordered the cover that comes with a seal...:rauch10: It looks like a bolt with an odd shaped head...:fing32:

The electric solenoid is an optional capability, as is the optional adjustment screw you can order and install...:Stop: What that's gonna do for the performance...:swow:

You also mentioned that you did not think the electric solenoid shut off the gas.

When I was talking to a tech at B&S they said "The solenoid doesn't shut off the gas flow, it starves the engine"...:fing20:

I'll get the parts in a few days and continue my controlled scienctific experiments...:ROF
 
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