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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
My GT has almost 300 hours on it and having just bought it, I don't know if the tractor got the 250hr oil change. To be safe, I am going to change it. I read about the procedure and found information elsewhere that all Tuff Torq trannies are supposed to use 5W-50 synthetic, except models sold in JDs which are supposed to use Hy-GARD (J20D).

Having read a lot about hydraulic oil in hydrostatic transmissions, it seems the universal thought is to either go JD, or go with Mobil 1 5W-50, the only synthetic I know of in that viscosity. Ammsoil's hydro fluid they say meets the J20D spec is 5w-30. Does anyone know if Hy-Gard is syn or not? If so, what viscosity? I have heard people say they are putting Hy-Gard in their cars, but I am hearing more people talking about putting Mobil 1 in their trannies.

The Mobil 1 5W-50 can be bought at Wally World in Canada, but not here, or where I have looked. Mobil says the product has "selected" distribution in the US. I saw one online retailer in the US that sells it, but there has to be other places, or other synthetics to use?

I also hear some JD dealer's price on the product can vary quite a bit. I know my local JD dealer is at least MSRP on everything...only deal he gives is seats in the spring.

What are the rest of you using? If Ammsoil 5w-30 is good, wouldn't the Mobil 1 5W-30 be about the same? Are they all the same product with different viscosities? Seems weird putting motor oil in a transmission. I do remember a friends car that had a common engine and transmission fluid. Took 12 quarts to do an oil change.

Share your vast wisdom please! :praying:

Lew
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Hiya... Although not a tested oil, I wonder how that blend would compare to the ones in this test:

http://www.performanceoilnews.com/oils_against_oils.shtml

You can see why I picked Mobil 1 to try vs. paying more for the ones above it in the list.

They are testing them as engine oils, not as transmission fluids, so I am not so sure HP tests and some others tests are applicable. Amsoil clearly won in a couple categories, and got the nod overall, but they weren't ranking the Amsoil tractor fluid which is 5w-30.

Would have been interesting if there had been another 5W-50 in the test, like the Syntec. I used to use castrol 60w in my H-D.

Thanks
 

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I'd use what JD recomends.
 

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I used the castrol in my K66 when I serviced my Simplicity Conquest's transaxle.
Came recommended right from TT tech dept. through an e-mail.

MU
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Castrol make 5w50 synthetic

This is what I put in my transaxle.

Do you know about the Syntec "scandal"?

http://faq.f650.com/FAQs/OILFAQ.htm

I don't know if things are changed or not, but it appears Syntec is a "fake" synthetic and can't claim to be synthetic in Germany and I am German :)

As far as what JD recommends, I have two problems with that.

1. I take the hydrostatic manufacturers recommendation over JD as we know JD has a reason to suggest their own products

2. We know what happened to all the car companies. You will use our oil, our filter, our plugs, our everything, and you will bring your car into our dealership for all service or your warranty is void. How many years ago was that?

If you say what JD reccomends, are you including any oil with their spec? Chevron THF W, Texaco TDH W
and Amsoil Tractor Hydraulic fluid all say they meet the J20D low viscosity formula. Others like Castrol and Mobil 1 don't say their product matches that spec. I don't even know if THF and TDH are synthetic, just know they meet the spec. Amsoil is a 5w-30 synthetic and is the more expensive base product also used in Mobil 1.

Thanks again!
 

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Do you know about the Syntec "scandal"?

http://faq.f650.com/FAQs/OILFAQ.htm

I don't know if things are changed or not, but it appears Syntec is a "fake" synthetic and can't claim to be synthetic in Germany and I am German :)

As far as what JD recommends, I have two problems with that.

1. I take the hydrostatic manufacturers recommendation over JD as we know JD has a reason to suggest their own products

2. We know what happened to all the car companies. You will use our oil, our filter, our plugs, our everything, and you will bring your car into our dealership for all service or your warranty is void. How many years ago was that?

If you say what JD reccomends, are you including any oil with their spec? Chevron THF W, Texaco TDH W
and Amsoil Tractor Hydraulic fluid all say they meet the J20D low viscosity formula. Others like Castrol and Mobil 1 don't say their product matches that spec. I don't even know if THF and TDH are synthetic, just know they meet the spec. Amsoil is a 5w-30 synthetic and is the more expensive base product also used in Mobil 1.

Thanks again!
Yes, I was aware of that dispute between Mobil and Castrol.

Here in Canada it's Amsoil that is difficult to find, I know they have good product but like said before if Tuff Torq recommend it and they are not doing profit with it. :fing32:
 

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AMsoil 5-30/30 is not a motor oil and probably has a entirely different add pack than motor oil. I plan on trying that when I get more hours on mine. If the 5-50 is good per the manufacturer of the axke I would think it's OK in deere also. They are going to recommend their stuff of course. If 5-50 syn meets JDC/D specs it won't void the warranty on newer machines.

As far as the fued things are different in Europe. here Castrol won, a hydro cracked group III is considered full synthetic. I don't agree with that but thats the way it is.
 

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How much oil does a hydro use? How often will it be changed? Exactly how much $ are you going to save over JD HyGard? I go with the simple answer, gen-u-ine JD HyGard, it's JD specs AND I have no kids in school that absolutely have to have $90 sneakers.:D
 

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How much oil does a hydro use? How often will it be changed? Exactly how much $ are you going to save over JD HyGard? I go with the simple answer, gen-u-ine JD HyGard, it's JD specs AND I have no kids in school that absolutely have to have $90 sneakers.:D
You've got a good point there.:fing32:
 

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Discussion Starter #14
I used the castrol in my K66 when I serviced my Simplicity Conquest's transaxle.
Came recommended right from TT tech dept. through an e-mail.

MU
How long ago was that? Was it recommended instead of Mobil 1 due to how hard it is to get the Mobil 1 here? Wouldn't make sense for them to suggest something you can't get.

Back in the mineral oil days, there as a distinction made between mid-continent oil and Pennyslvania oil (meaning all the oil from that time era) in that the Pennsylvania oil had a higher paraffin content and was known to sludge your engine sooner. Since we now get crude from all over the world, I wonder if we even know what oil comes from Texas or Kansas vs. Pennsylvania vs. Saudi Arabia?

Since I don't know the source of the base oil in the Castrol, I would still feel safer with a true synthetic.

Thanks!
 

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Discussion Starter #15
How much oil does a hydro use? How often will it be changed? Exactly how much $ are you going to save over JD HyGard? I go with the simple answer, gen-u-ine JD HyGard, it's JD specs AND I have no kids in school that absolutely have to have $90 sneakers.:D
I think there are two issues here and your only addressing one of them, and that is cost. This isn't only about cost, it is about getting the very best lube there is. We know JD doesn't make the oil, so they are buying something and putting their label on it. We don't know what they are buying, but are you so sure that because JD bought something (probably based on bid price, not based on winning a test) and slapped a label on it, that it is the very best product you can use?

How many people here use Mobil 1 for their engine oil vs. the JD product? Are they doing it for a money reason or to use the very best product they can for their engine?

I have far less JD experience than most people who would read this, but I have been in and out of the auto business since the 60's when I worked as a mechanic in a gas station and saw those sludged up engines come in that ran Pennsoil, Quaker, and other paraffin-based oils.

When I was no longer able to ascertain the origin of the crude to help me choose what oil to bought, I started buying the cheapest name brand oil I could that met the spec.

There are probably three groups of owners.

1. True Greene users who blindly buy nothing buy JD products for their tractors, which isn't a bad thing

2. The people who buy the cheapest products, such as bulk Citgo oil from Fleet Farm, or whatever motor oil they can get a nice rebate on. They will buy whatever is cheapest and put it in everything they own.

3. Those who aren't as swayed by price as they are by quality. Those who know that the manufacturer probably doesn't package the best of every product. I have also worked for corporate america and know that many buyers are directly to buy the cheapest product that meets spec to re-label.

I fall into the 3rd category when it comes to this kind of product. Part of me finds it hard to believe that JD researched all the products out there and put their name on the very best product. If for instance, it was the Amsoil product. Do you think that is what is in their can? I don't think so.

One more example...back in the 60s the best "name" spark plug was made by Prestolite which also made Ford's plugs. Delco made AC for GM and Chrysler partnered with Champion. None of the motor companies chose their sparkplug brand based on what was best, but what they could buy the cheapest, just like the tires they threw on the cars. Although at the time I drove Dodges, I knew Champion wasn't as good as Prestolite so that is what I bought. And when I couldn't get Prestolite, I bought Autolite as they were Prestolite.

At the same time, the highest rated motor oil was Havoline so that is what I always bought. I would seek out Texaco stations to get my oil changes if I wasn't going to do it myself.

As another poster said, I would take the word of TT over JD on this matter, and if TT doesn't suggest JD's oil for the rest of their line, doesn't that say something? If they only suggest JD oil for hydros put in JDs, you know they are doing it to stay "friends" with JD, but because it isn't suggested for other Hydros, it isn't really their preferred lube, which is 5w-50 synthetic. Since they have no axe to grind, their suggestion chart doesn't list a brand. They just know that the viscosity characteristics of 5W-50 are what is best for their hydros. I bet HyGard doesn't match that spec, and therefore, probably isn't the best lube for that purpose.

If you are a type 1 person that believes everything JD does is best, then some disgruntled former employee would reveal what JD repackages and that is what you would buy, at a reduced price, but maybe that info has never leaked out.

Thanks to one and all! :thanku:
 

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I've always used Pennzoil (High quality) or Bradpenn (Make it right here in PA 20 miles from me! With 100% pennsylvania crude) Never ever had sludge with them. the people you saw probably never changed the oil! You are putting engine oil in a Hydro trans-axle made to run on hydrolic oil.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
I think the distinction between hydraulic fluid and engine oil isn't very much.

1. I mentioned my friend's car that runs a common motor oil that is shared by both the engine and the transmission

2. Engines have hydraulics in them, such as the lifters, so the engine oil is also performing a hydraulic function

3. Many hydros, especially cheaper ones, use engine oil as their recommended oil.

4. Synthentic oils probably offered expanded ability, performing the duties of a engine oil and offering the hydraulic abilities of a hydraulic fluid.

5. If Tuff Torq suggests a 5W-50 lubricant in their hydros, and to my knowledge, there isn't a single tranny-only hydraulic fluid made, then they must be talking about using an oil made for engines, not for trannies. Another responder said a TT tech told him to use the Castrol 5W-50 which must be the engine oil.

Maybe it is time to write my own mail to TT and ask them if their recommendation also encompasses the Mobil 1 and possibly other products I am not aware of.

Thanks again!
 

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Discussion Starter #19
I think the information on the TT web site says it all:

K71A, B, C, P J20C Hy-Gard High Viscosity J20C Hy-Gard High Viscosity 4.60

K71E, G, H, J, L 5w50 Synthetic Motor Oil - Part# 1115 10w30 API Class Motor Oil 4.60

1. they are specifying a MOTOR OIL in all instances, not a hydraulic fluid

2. The former K71 recommended fluid was plain old 10W-30 motor oil (can't tell in how I did it, but the second suggestion was the former suggestion, the first one is the currently suggested fluid)

3. The K71s sold to JD they suggest JD fluid (probably under duress).

4. All other K71s suggest 5W-50 synthetic MOTOR OIL.

Do you really think there is a difference between the various K71 trannies sold by JD and to everyone else? Not much difference than TV manufacturers adding a special knob or button on a TV so they can call it a different model number so people can't price compare between the major audio/video stores vs. wholesale stores.
 

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