[dmac601]

I currently have two H4514's. One has a black frame and the other is grey, which is older? :thanku:

 

[Dave4514]

All of the 4514 tractors were built with serial numbers on the frame. They started with 1000001 and ended with 4199999 according to the shop manual. I will guess the lower the number the earlier the build.

 

[dlandsv]

Dave

You have answered a question I was wondering about. Most 4514's that I see with posts or for sale have the black frame, yet mine is grey.

Now I know why - there are actually two frame colors - so I guess mine isn't a fluke.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/5859046016/in/set-72157626516992426

http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/5859044724/in/set-72157626516992426/

FWIW and don't know if it will help with your question.

I purchased my 4514 from the original owner and got the original owner's manual with it along with the marketing brochure from the dealer. The copyright on the brochure is 1992. So mine with a gray frame must be at least a 1992.

The models during that year were the H4518HSA, H4514HSA, and the H4013SA. The 4013 had a single cylinder engine with a MAT standard transmission.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/5858484247/in/set-72157626516992426/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/5858488005/in/set-72157626516992426/

Two other peculiarities I have noticed :dunno:

I have two 3813's and a 4213. All take 1.48 qts of oil per owners' manual.

However the 4514 takes 1.16 qts of oil per owner's manual.

The brochure states the 4514 is 14 HP but most posts here say that it is actually only 13 hp. I really don't care about the 1 hp difference. But if there is a one hp difference am wondering if anyone knows what the differences are: compression ratio, timing, rpm increase ????

I understand perhaps why the HP would be increased to account for the bigger capacity snowblower and/or the hydrostatic drive (hp loss) vs standard transmission (less hp loss).

The 4013 looks like a very nice unit - sure would like to find one to add to my herd. A 4018 would be nice to have too.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/6529475377/in/photostream

hth :thThumbsU

 

[larryccf]

Dave


Two other peculiarities I have noticed :dunno:

I have two 3813's and a 4213. All take 1.48 qts of oil per owners' manual.

However the 4514 takes 1.16 qts of oil per owner's manual.

The brochure states the 4514 is 14 HP but most posts here say that it is actually only 13 hp. I really don't care about the 1 hp difference. But if there is a one hp difference am wondering if anyone knows what the differences are: compression ratio, timing, rpm increase ????

I understand perhaps why the HP would be increased to account for the bigger capacity snowblower and/or the hydrostatic drive (hp loss) vs standard transmission (less hp loss).

The 4013 looks like a very nice unit - sure would like to find one to add to my herd. A 4018 would be nice to have too.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/6529475377/in/photostream

hth :thThumbsU

suspect someone at honda that prepared the 4514 manual confused the oil amount necessary without changing the oil filter, with the amt required when you did install a new oil filter. Engine block, cylinder head were identical or interchangeable, so oil qty has to be same.

as to the hp difference, from the svc manual for the 4514, the true hp is 13 and it maxes at 13 hp at 3000 rpm, with torque maxing out at 2500 rpm and a warning not to exceed 3300 rpm. The 3813's hp i've seen in honda literature listed in some places as 12.2 hp maxing out at 3600 rpm, but torque maxes out at 3300 rpm. Since they'd already rounded the 3813's hp to 13, with the 4514, they needed (marketing wise) to show increased power as well, so they rounded up to 14. no biggee to me

don't know if mentioned this in the earlier post, but it finally dawned on me why the 4514's torque maxed out at 2500 RPM - there was a gov't reg that came out limiting the cutting blade speed, forget what the limit was, but suspect cause of the lowered blade speed, honda moved the torque down lower to give the blades the power at that lower rotational speed.

i havent done it, but suspect if we compare the diameter of the PTO pulleys and the mule drive pulleys on the two models, either the 4514's PTO pulley will be slightly smaller or the 4514's mule drive pulley would be slightly larger, to keep those blade speeds within the reg's limit.

 

[dlandsv]

All of the 4514 tractors were built with serial numbers on the frame. They started with 1000001 and ended with 4199999 according to the shop manual. I will guess the lower the number the earlier the build.

Forgot to mention in my earlier reply. I will look at the serial number on my 4514 tomorrow. Then comparing your serial number to mine, that should tell you which of the two (black or grey framed 4514) is the newer of the two.

I suppose mine could have been sitting on a showroom floor for a year or two and then when purchased, the original owner was given a brochure with a copyright date of 1992 making the tractor production date earlier than 1992 or vice versa.

 

[larryccf]

suspect the gray will be the later production. on the 3813s, the steering column frame tower on some are gray as well, and they seem to be later production units.

 

[dlandsv]

suspect someone at honda that prepared the 4514 manual confused the oil amount necessary without changing the oil filter, with the amt required when you did install a new oil filter. Engine block, cylinder head were identical or interchangeable, so oil qty has to be same.

I don't want to disagree - but I doubt Honda would make a typo or an assumption like that based on their track record for quality control.

On a hunch based on what happened with my 1998 Camaro when a vendor replaced the dipstick tube and then told me my Camaro was low on oil - I decided to check the dipstick length on the 3813 and also on the 4514.

The 4514 dipstick length is longer by about a 1/4 inch which makes sense since the end of dipstick has to protrude deeper into the oil pan to get the correct measurement since there is less oil in the crankcase.

So based on my unscientific test I think that the manual is correct at 1.16 qts.

I recall now that I had to remove oil when I last changed oil and filter because with 1.48 qts of oil, it was way over full on the dipstick.

Anybody else want to chime in about this issue please do do.

 

[Dave4514]

My owner's manual has the oil capacity listed as 1.16 quarts when changing the oil. There is no mention of the oil filter. The service manual has the oil capacity listed as 1.48 quarts but includes instructions on changing the filter. According to Honda's maintenance schedule the oil is changed every 100 hours and the filter every 300 hours, so both oil numbers may be correct depending on the filter change.

My 4514 has a black frame with serial number MZAS-2001668 and was bought by me in July of 1992.

 

[larryccf]

suspect someone at honda that prepared the 4514 manual confused the oil amount necessary without changing the oil filter, with the amt required when you did install a new oil filter. Engine block, cylinder head were identical or interchangeable, so oil qty has to be same.

I don't want to disagree - but I doubt Honda would make a typo or an assumption like that based on their track record for quality control..........

whether a typo, or simply not stating whether an oil filter is included in the oil change, i'm not sure how else to explain a supposedly different oil qty for the same engine block / crank case, whether in a 3813, 4213 or 4514, especially when that number matches up with the "with filter' or "without oil filter" quantities on the other engines.

plus, i've seen a few similiar disparate specs from honda on the same engine, in different manuals. Keep in mind, this was the early 1990s, and asian manuals translated into english were still pretty horrible. Honda's were obviously much better, but still not without flaws.