My Tractor Forum banner

1 - 20 of 24 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
26 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hi, Im absolutely new about tractors with the exception of having run a Ford 8n or 9n (Not sure) probably 10 or more years ago, It was my father inlaws tractor which is long gone now. The seller is asking $4k OBO it comes with a brush hog, finish mower, back blade and Ford hydraulic manure bucket (Has one hydraulic arm) I asked him if the PTO is live or not live and he said he believes its considered a "live" pto because he says the pto will run even if the tractor is not being driven. He started the tractor up and after a few minutes I noticed a little smoke coming from the engine, he said its just blow back smoke and I could not tell, is this normal should I be too concened? he lifted the bucket up and also the hydraulic lift in the back and the tractor sounded nice no sputtering or suspicious noises heard, it just seemed to purr. He has a 12V battery connected to it, and I asked him if it was supposed to run off a 6 v and he told me that for the 5 years he has owned it, it has run of a 12v battery, but the generator couldn't charge it and that he sometimes charges the battery, he didn't seem to know too much about tractors either and said that he's just used it for cutting his lawn and plowing snow, and he also used the bucket to move large rocks when he first landscaped the property 5 years ago. He wasn't sure of the procedure on how to remove the manure bucket life but said he believed you just remove the pins and try and hoist it up to release it. Although he told me its a 601, im not sure which model number it really is, I emailed him to get me the serial number so perhaps that will determine it. My main concern is the smoke and the generator, Im wondering if the Generator just isnt able to charge a 12v but perhaps it will charge a 6 V, is it possible to hook up a 12V to a 6V system without first converting it over? Whats the opinion on a work master? Thankyou!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,268 Posts
The 601 series between 1957/'61. Complete 12 volt conversion is about a couple of hundred dollar with a new battery and you already have the battery. You'll need a 12 volt alternator. That's why the battery keeps going dead. Why was in changed from 6 volt in the first place?? Low compression?? Smoke is alway a concern to me. Moreso than the conversion. The serial # is located on the flat spot on the bellhousing just behind the starter. Above that will be the model #.
As far as price it's hard to judge with out seeing photos or the condition of the tractor. Price seem a little high in todays market at least in my area. Again like I said hard to judge without looking at it and with all the inpelments in may be worth it.

Kirk
 

·
Retired - Veteran Mod
Joined
·
6,791 Posts
Follow Kirk's most excellent directions to find the serial number (and model number) then cross reference those 2 numbers by following the link in my signature to find out a whole bunch of stuff about your potential new tractor.

The charging system needs to be fixed... either completely revert it back to 6V or completely convert it over to 12V. Otherwise... I don't think that the price sounds too far out of the ballpark (granted, it's not really a 'bargain', but it's not an unfair price) for the implements that you've indicated (I'm kind of assuming that the "Ford hydraulic manure bucket (Has one hydraulic arm)" that you've referred to is a front end loader? Possibly a 1-arm loader?)

Get some pictures and let us see what you're talking about... for a better estimation...


:goodl:

and...

:Welcome1:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,864 Posts
More info is needed.

I question the sellers description of live pto.

The pto will spin, in neutral, without the tractor moving, as long as you don't have your foot on the clutch on a non live pto model.. and that sounds like what he is describing. For it to be a live pto model it will need to be a 661 or an SOS model with a 10spd column shifter.

the 661 will have a 2-stage clutch and 5 speed tranny that has a 'stacked' shifter.. IE.. a top, middle, and lower gate, and the shifter only moves / rotates foward or aft.. 3+R, 2+1, and 5+4.. with a neutral at each level.

the 4 speed ie.. a 641 will be more of an H pattern.

there is also a 5 spd non live pto.. a 651.

A lil smoke from the breather isn't a big problem as long as it doesnt chug real bad.. or blow white smoke.

1 arm maneuer bucket? A 1-arm front end loader perhaps? I take it this is driven off a valve on the hyd top cover back by the seat?.. if this is what it is.. it's a neat loader. trip bucket or hyd bucket?

as for the 12v issue.. you have a few choices.

go back to 6v, keep it 12v and put in an alternator, or keep it 12v and put in a 12v generator for a diesel 01 series plus the regulator that goes with it.. ( or have your generator rebuilt as 12v, plus the new regulator. etc.. )

got any pics?

as a reference.. I paid 3500$ for a 660 ( live pto, 1955 year ) with a 1-arm loader that had a hyd bucket. runs good.

soundguy
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
26 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
Here are the couple pics I have, wish I would have got some of the cockpit, the bucket he said was a trip release type. the back tires had a bit of dry rot.




 

·
Retired - Veteran Mod
Joined
·
6,791 Posts
I can tell by the shifter that it's got the 4 speed transmission in it... making it (most likely) a 641 (at least it's got the later x01 rear fenders on it).

I still say that I don't think that $4K is a bad price for that bundle, in my opinion. If you can get it for less, I'd say go for it, but....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,864 Posts
641.. no live pto.. but no big deal.. just get an ORC for the mowers.

Tractor has a nice 711 ford 1-arm trip loader on it.. evidentally run by a single remote on the hyd top cover... the remote itself is worth 300$ or so in value.. the laoder is worth about 75$.. but the bracket set that hangs the loader to the tractor is valued at about 200$..

4000$ for that package is an ok deal... even with non live pto and a hair of smoke.

soundguy
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,864 Posts
that 3000 diesel is about 38 hp.. but is an 8spd trans.. better gear selection... 2 stage clutch is nice.. though i do see the evidence of a few leaks under her.. unless he made a mess servicing it.

your choice.. I think all the implements with that other tractor.. plus the light duty utility loader it has wil make a great tool.

check both units out.

soundguy
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
26 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
:thanku: Im amazed that you guys can gather all that info from those pics! I will let you guys know if I get it or check into another, I might make an offer on the workmaster
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,674 Posts
:thanku: Im amazed that you guys can gather all that info from those pics!
There are guys on here that can tell you what it is by the oil stain on the ground. :lalala:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
26 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
I spoke with the seller today who says he will let it go for $3600 delivered (1 hr drive) with the implements and some manuals that he purchased. Im going to go and give it a test run tommorow and will probably have a tractor at home :thThumbsU , would it be okay to cut the grass with the loader attached? He says he's never taken it off, im just wondering if cutting with the extra front weight would cause unnecessary strain on it. If it all works out, I wont be renting a mower anymore or paying for the drive to be plowed in the winter, im also hoping the blade can be used to scrape and loosen up the gravel on the drive. If she is mine, Im going to tape up the steering wheel, it doesnt have much meat left on it, mostly steel, but will be looking for a replacement. Im also going to need some type of plow for a garden that we want to put in, what type should I be looking for, garden to be about 1 acre max, My father inlaw use to have all sorts of implements but my mother inlaw sold it all with the 'N' tractor for $1000 a few years ago after he passed away. Anyways I sure appreciate all the help here, and Im hope to be a regular here on this forum. Will get some pics up and look up that serial number once I get it. Im sure I will have lots more questions.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,268 Posts
You may need to get an ORC on the pto for the mower/brushhog as others have stated or else leave yourself plenty of stopping room. After viewing photo's it does appear to be too bad a deal. Everything looks to be in good shape, at least in the photos. Post some photos when (and If) you buy it.

Kirk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
821 Posts
You may need to get an ORC on the pto for the mower/brushhog as others have stated or else leave yourself plenty of stopping room. After viewing photo's it does appear to be too bad a deal. Everything looks to be in good shape, at least in the photos. Post some photos when (and If) you buy it.

Kirk
When I was a kid, I was pulling the bailer with a Ford and I got a little to close to a fence at the end of a run. The tractor wouldn't turn sharp enough and pushing the clutch in and hitting the brakes did no good! Needless to say, the fence was toast and a broken head light later we all came to a stop.
Good thing I wasn't in front of a building.
The over run device was a great invention and I also tell everyone not in the know to use one. It's no joke really and could be very serious!
 

·
Retired - Veteran Mod
Joined
·
6,791 Posts
I spoke with the seller today who says he will let it go for $3600 delivered (1 hr drive) with the implements and some manuals that he purchased. Im going to go and give it a test run tommorow and will probably have a tractor at home :thThumbsU , would it be okay to cut the grass with the loader attached? He says he's never taken it off, im just wondering if cutting with the extra front weight would cause unnecessary strain on it. If it all works out, I wont be renting a mower anymore or paying for the drive to be plowed in the winter, im also hoping the blade can be used to scrape and loosen up the gravel on the drive. If she is mine, Im going to tape up the steering wheel, it doesnt have much meat left on it, mostly steel, but will be looking for a replacement. Im also going to need some type of plow for a garden that we want to put in, what type should I be looking for, garden to be about 1 acre max, My father inlaw use to have all sorts of implements but my mother inlaw sold it all with the 'N' tractor for $1000 a few years ago after he passed away. Anyways I sure appreciate all the help here, and Im hope to be a regular here on this forum. Will get some pics up and look up that serial number once I get it. Im sure I will have lots more questions.
Ya know... now I think that you're getting into "bargain country"!!! :fing32:

Steering wheels... those're easy. Steiner Tractor carries them (look at the top of the page). Just8Ns carries them. They're all OVER eBay. Tractor Supply (here anyway) stocks them. You're looking at about $40-$50 for the wheel... add in a little for a new 'acorn' nut.
Plow... look for a 3 point hitch, 2 bottom (2-14 would be perfect, 2-12 would be fine, 2-10 is a little small, but... hey, 2-16... you probably would have problems pulling 2-16's unless you have IDEAL soil)
As to mowing with the loader... it really shouldn't be too big of a deal, but then... as I understand it (and hopefully Chris will be along to straighten me up... since he's the man, when it comes to the 1-arm loaders) those 1-arm loaders are easier to dismount than the more "conventional" loaders are (not nearly to the extent of a modern quick-connect, but...)

Just keep in mind that charging circuit. Once you get it home :hide: take some detailed notes of what charging components are on it and how (if?) they're wired. Some detailed, close-up pictures would probably come in real handy.
Speaking of pictures... take your camera along with you when you go test-drive it.

:goodl:


P.S. Yes... DO get an over-running clutch (ORC) on there... if it doesn't already have one... and if it does have one... make sure that it is operating properly and is well lubricated.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,864 Posts
do get the ORC.

3600$ plus those implements is deffinately in 'deal' territory!

1-arm loaders have 3 common mount points.. a 'toe' under the front axle, a nub on the side of the tranny, and a tie plate under the tranny.

remove the bolt from the tractor unde rthe tranny tie plate, then pull the pin out of the nub and then you can slip the loader foto off onto some cribbing the same height as the loader.. then pull the pin on the toe and scooch her back 1.5" and she is free.

if you do this with the tractor wheels cut all the way to the right, then you can just drive out from under her.

a strong tree limb and a chain makes this very easy.. then just back in witht he wheels cut to the right and manhandle her onthat swinging chain to install in opposite order.. ie, toe first, then nub, then tie plate. I use a ratchet strap to pul the loader frame in toward the radius arm to help line up the tie plate wheile you get the bolt in.. unless you have a second person to push on it a lil. then it's ez as pie... then you need to unplumb the hyds.

as a cheat, you can also add a quick disconnect to the hyd line, and then remov ethe large set screw at the top of the loader boom on the left side, and then tap that pin out while someone wiggles the boom.. then pull the bottom loader cyl pin... that leaves just the upright and lower frame on the tractor.. then when you are ready to reinstall.. just slip the boom back into place and tap the greased up pin in ( save it in a 1g ziplock baggy ).. then replace the set screw, and ram cyl pin, then clean and plug in loader quic disconnect line.

soundguy
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
26 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
Hey guys I have the tractor, didn't take any pics yet as I've been out there trying to cut the grass. Already have a problem though and I hope its not something serious :fing20: I hooked up the finish mower, had a rough time trying to hook it up to the 3 pt hitch for the first time but finally got it on, cut several swipes of lawn until the tractor ran outta gas, put 10 gallons in and now for some reason when I let up off the clutch and the pto is turning the motor stalls out, I then have to choke the motor for a second start it and open it up, and the lever that runs the hitch lift stopped lifting the mower, I found another lever underneath that one that will lower and raise it up but the other one stopped working. I thought maybe the mower's fluid might have been low, but I checked it and its full on the dip stick. Looking at the mower, it does not look like its evenly distributed on the 3 pt hitch and im thinking this might be binding it? I will run out and get some pics of the hitch and the levers im speaking of, will get more pics tommorow if its not raining. I did notice something on the shafts of the mowers, the plastic sleeves are all torn up on both of them, im not exactly how that occured.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
26 Posts
Discussion Starter #18 (Edited)
It took me awhile with dial up to get the pics up, 1st pic is of the little lever that I used to get the hydraulics to work in the back when the other lever seemed to stop working. Also noticed some oil spots, its definetly a 641 :thanku: Im going to get one of those ORC doesnt look to difficult to put on., the seller gave me a new coil and tune up kit and some cable for the trip bucket which broke off. Eventually I'd like to put a light kit on, but first I want to make sure that I can clean up those oil spots or figure out where its leaking at.

I just went out there and started her up and the lever is working again for the rear lift so Im thinking it might be over heating?

















 

·
Retired - Veteran Mod
Joined
·
6,791 Posts
So...

That little lever is your position control/draft control selector. The horizontal position (where you have it in the pictures) is for position control. Rotating the lever (pointing down) is the draft control position.
Position control controls the attached implement's postion above ground. This is primarily used when mowing or if using any type of lifting implement (i.e. a bale spear, or boom pole).
Draft control controls the 'draft' of ground engaging equipment... or how deeply a plow will cut. Draft control (ideally) will keep the tractor from digging itself to a standstill, while plowing. I would recommend using draft control with any ground engaging implements (plow, middlebuster, cultivator, disk, etc).

Once your position control/draft control selector lever is in the position control setting... then your left lever should control the height of your mower.

As to your 'running' issues... I'd put that ignition tune-up kit in it sooner rather than later. This is a gravity feed fuel system, so... there's no concern about bleeding the lines... or anything like that, after running out of gas. The shutoff valve on your fuel line should contain a 'reserve' setting. Ideally you would open the valve ~2 turns for normal use. When (if?) you run out of gas... open the valve fully for a final gallon or so of fuel... should be enough to get you back to the barn.
 
1 - 20 of 24 Posts
Top