My Tractor Forum banner

1 - 11 of 11 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
5 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Okay gentlemen, I have an issue that I need to get resolved, I bought a 600 Ford tractor that was converted to a 12 volt system and I need some help. The tractor has trouble cutting off after it has been ran awhile, sounds like it is trying to start after the key is cut off. I have been told that it may be due to the 12 volt conversion done on it. I have researched the entire web and cannot find a wiring diagram for the 600 hundred, can find plenty on the N series. can someone help me?
 

·
10K and Climbin!
Joined
·
12,140 Posts
You hear the engine cranking when the key is off? Not good for your starter! Or does the the thing run/fire erratcally after turning off.. If it is the latter, check your engine idle speed.. It could be too high which would cause the thing to run on a bit after ignition is off.. I've seen it many times..

If the starter is turning you need to trace out the start circuit and determine where things are crossed up..

:goodl:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5 Posts
Discussion Starter #3 (Edited)
No Sir the starter is not running, the engine just has trouble shutting off, it keeps sputtering and spitting, not sure what is causing it, someone had said that the timing was off, checked that and put it at 8 BTDC at an idle, someone said that the wiring in the coversion could be screwed up, just not sure what it is, but I cant find a wiring diagram for the 12 volt conversion to compare it with, all I find is conversions on the N series, with a front or side distrubator.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
OOPS, the starter is not running, it turns off right after the engine starts just the motor keeps sputtering and will not stop until you put it in gear and put a strain on the motor then it will die
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,265 Posts
Sounds like the system is backfeeding probably from the alt. Some guys will use a marker light to prevent this. I don't if your 600 has the light on the dash like that the X01 series has. I'm not all that good will the electric. Perhaps Soundguy will come along and explain it in detail.
Here is the diagram for the 601/801 12volt conversion. I can email if you can't make it out.

Kirk
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
853 Posts
The tractor has trouble cutting off after it has been ran awhile, sounds like it is trying to start after the key is cut off. I have been told that it may be due to the 12 volt conversion done on it.
Sounds like you've got a Delco 10SI or 12SI on there with a two-wire or three-wire hookup? Problem is charge-backfeed through the #1 exciter wire. Very common problem. Just cut the wire going to #1 terminal on top of the alternator and stick in a 50 watt (or bigger) diode. That will stop the backfeed. Just make sure you have it pointing the correct direction. It has to let power go TO the alternator, but NOT come back. You can buy for a buck or two at Radio Shack. I usually put in two, hooked in parallel. This way if one goes bad you've got redundancy.

Also, if you install an automotive type ignition switch with separate IGN and ACC terminals, you can avoid the problem without any diodes. Just run the ignition circuit to IGN and the alternator excite wire to ACC. When you turn the key off, they are isolated from each other.

Normally, #1 is run through an idiot-light bulb that has enough resistance to stop backfeed - but the bulb often is not enough. Thus the reason for using a diode that is basically an electrical one-way check-valve.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
106 Posts
Okay gentlemen, I have an issue that I need to get resolved, I bought a 600 Ford tractor that was converted to a 12 volt system and I need some help. The tractor has trouble cutting off after it has been ran awhile, sounds like it is trying to start after the key is cut off. I have been told that it may be due to the 12 volt conversion done on it. I have researched the entire web and cannot find a wiring diagram for the 600 hundred, can find plenty on the N series. can someone help me?
Duckslayer,

Feedback from your electricals can be eliminated as a cause like this:

1...Disconnect a wire from the coil and put a temporary jumper between it and the terminal you took it off of.
2...Run the tractor as you have been but now turn off the key AND yank this jumper.
3...If it still "runs on" then what you're describing sounds like "dieseling"...the engine is off timing or terribly overheating (don't trust your gauge!) or the chambers are badly carboned up.

Tim
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,674 Posts
No Sir the starter is not running, the engine just has trouble shutting off, it keeps sputtering and spitting, not sure what is causing it, someone had said that the timing was off, checked that and put it at 8 BTDC at an idle, someone said that the wiring in the coversion could be screwed up, just not sure what it is, but I cant find a wiring diagram for the 12 volt conversion to compare it with, all I find is conversions on the N series, with a front or side distrubator.
OK, by you saying it is sputtering and spitting I assume it is not running a smooth as it does with the switch on, if so then that means the engine is dieseling. That will not be caused by wiring. The cause could be timing, to high idle and/or carbon build up in the cylinders, engine running to hot.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
853 Posts
Here is the diagram for the 601/801 12volt conversion. I can email if you can't make it out.

Kirk
That diagram will only work if the indicator bulb has enough resistance to stop back-flow. Doesn't always work and is especially problematic on diesels with electric shutoffs. Also, even if the bulb does stop enough flow to allow shut-down, the alternator will not charge if that bulb burns out.

Spending a couple of bucks and wiring in a 50 watt or better diode works much better and is very reliable. You can buy from Radio Shack a 1N5402 or 1N5404 for a $1.60 each. Wire two in parallel and they'll last forever. Each can carry 3 amps, so one is more then enough and two gives added insurance. So, $3 or $4 and problem is solved.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
853 Posts
OK, by you saying it is sputtering and spitting I assume it is not running a smooth as it does with the switch on, if so then that means the engine is dieseling. That will not be caused by wiring. The cause could be timing, to high idle and/or carbon build up in the cylinders, engine running to hot.
Yes, but it can also mean it IS caused by the alternator. If you have a charge-indicator "idiot light" hooked up, the bulb can be lowering voltage to the coil but not stopping current flow completely. Thus the spark will be enough to keep chugged, but too weak to run properly.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
821 Posts
If your getting a compression knock while it's running on, it's dieseling! Could be loaded with carbon deposits in the tops of the cylinders/head and valve heads. The wrong plugs running in the wrong heat range can cause dieseling under certain conditions also. The heavy carbon, if that's the problem, is usually from a too rich fuel mixture. When carbon particles get hot, they will ignite unburnt fuel after the ignition is turned off. But I guess you know that.
 
1 - 11 of 11 Posts
Top