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Discussion Starter #1
Ive been waiting for a window to broadcast spray 2 4 D in advance of core aeration and overseeding. But, we have been stuck in a cycle of late day storms every day and I am running out of time to seed. If I spray in the morning and it gets hit with a storm late day is it the end of the world? Or should I wait it out and just not seed if I run out of time? The product says 3 to 4 weeks before seeding which is getting a little late here already.
 

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It will usually say on the label what the minimum time is between application and any rain. I think both 2,4-D and glyphosate have about a 4-6 hour 'rainproof' time. You can spray with dew still on the grass with no decrease in effectiveness, it may actually increase absorption. Another way to speed absorption is to use a surfactant in the mix. That decreases the surface tension of the liquid so it "sticks" better and doesn't bead up and roll off the vegetation. I use a small squirt (about 10ml) of dishwashing liquid in the tank when I make my mix (25 gallons); just a few drops is all that's necessary for a 5 gallon hand spray tank.
 

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Roundup Ultra W/ Liquid Nitrogen in the mix for fast burndown
 

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Discussion Starter #4
I am using a full load of armine400 from TSC in a 25 gallon tow behind. It doesn't say anything on the label about drying but I read 8 hours in the Q&A that the manufacturer answered.
 

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Should be rainsafe in just a few hours with a good surfactant.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Thanks for the advice gents. I decided to hold off yesterday and glad I did as we got 3/4" of rain starting at 2PM. I got it down first thing this morning and hope that it does its thing before storms hit later again today.

The sprayer came as part of the X595 package late last Fall. I originally thought I would sell it but it seems like a pretty convenient way to get product on the ground and the product seems cheaper too. While I hope to not have to do what I just did again (we will see how that goes), I may keep it anyway just to put fertilizer down in the Fall, crab preventer in the Spring and in the pretty rare event I need to put water down. The wand on that thing might be a nice ally as I go after the rest of the brush on the property. I was pleasantly surprised with how much volume these things put out...it was almost too much for what I was putting down this morning.
 

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It is important to adjust it/go at the right speed to put the product down at the correct amount/sq ft. Earlier this summer, one of my customers tried using a hand-carried sprayer for weed control, now his lawn has a bunch of patches where it varied from just too much to WAY too much product was put down, where the grass is either brown, but looks like it might come back next year, to this spot is dead, you need to put new grass here...

And they switched to a commercial company for spraying weed control/fertilizer.
 

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You want to put it on when the lawn is dry. Damp or dewy lawn dilutes the mix. Once on the plant it sucks it in right away,longer the better but a couple of hours is good. Surfactant as others mention helps a lot especially on smaller leaf plants like clover.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I cant imagine going after my lawn with a backpack sprayer. Im pretty sure mine is on or off, so the only adjustment is speed and I suppose changing nozzles. I went as fast as I reasonably could and ended up about 10% over what I thought I should have used. Who knows if my assumption about portion that is lawn is off, overlap varied (guaranteed), ground speed variance over my control area (not sure I have a flat spot on my little over 3 acres) or some combination thereof. Either way, initial indicators looked pretty good this afternoon.

Next up is an aerator rental and then spraying some fertilizer. Is next weekend too soon?
 

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Do some research on mesotrione herbicide. This might be what you want.
Tenacity (mesotrione) is great stuff, but you want to be certain your lawn is primarily made up of non-target grasses before spraying. If your lawn is primarily made up of "junk" grasses, it will kill them all. Not sure if it's urban legend or not - but the lawncare place I get my chemicals from tells a story of a guy who bought a house with a neglected lawn, sprayed tenacity, then ended up with dirt... Might as well have used Roundup.

On the 2,4-D: a 6- to 8-hour rain-free period is suggested for the amine formulations, while the suggested rain-free period for the ester is one hour. Residual 2,4-D in the soil can affect grass seed for up to 3 weeks.

I have a brinley pull behind sprayer and really like it. You do need to figure out the proper ground speed to put down 1 gallon per 1,000 (in my case at least). Next spring, I'm going to try spraying crabgrass preventer rather than buying dimension.
 

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Amine 400 is a one dimensional herbicide of 2-4 D. A three way herbicide will yield much better results, i.e. Vessel, Trimec or Mec Amine D. If you have hard to kill weeds such as ground ivy and wild violets consider a better product such as T-zone.

4 hours is the usual window for being rainfast, many are pretty safe once dried.

Timing is important when applying herbicides, the best time is early Spring when weeds are actively growing and before the grass has ever been cut. The target weeds will have much more surface area absorbing the herbicide. Fall is also a good time for application as the plant will translocate the herbicide to the root.

Summer is pretty poor as the weeds will have a waxing coating and will not absorb the material well. As others have said, use a surfactant such as Li-700.
 

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Tenacity (mesotrione) is great stuff, but you want to be certain your lawn is primarily made up of non-target grasses before spraying. If your lawn is primarily made up of "junk" grasses, it will kill them all. Not sure if it's urban legend or not - but the lawncare place I get my chemicals from tells a story of a guy who bought a house with a neglected lawn, sprayed tenacity, then ended up with dirt... Might as well have used Roundup.
We're getting a bit off-topic but excellent points.

I've had great success on my bluegrass lawn. I would also speculate that the Tenacity story is more urban legend and the user botched the application rate. Very little chemical is needed and more is most definitely not better.
 

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I cant imagine going after my lawn with a backpack sprayer. Im pretty sure mine is on or off, so the only adjustment is speed and I suppose changing nozzles. I went as fast as I reasonably could and ended up about 10% over what I thought I should have used. Who knows if my assumption about portion that is lawn is off, overlap varied (guaranteed), ground speed variance over my control area (not sure I have a flat spot on my little over 3 acres) or some combination thereof. Either way, initial indicators looked pretty good this afternoon.

Next up is an aerator rental and then spraying some fertilizer. Is next weekend too soon?
One thing to do to get a better feel for the sprayer is to fill it with water and spray on blacktop or stone to see what speed you need to go to get good coverage. Keep in mine throttle position also to stay consistent.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Amine 400 is a one dimensional herbicide of 2-4 D. A three way herbicide will yield much better results, i.e. Vessel, Trimec or Mec Amine D. If you have hard to kill weeds such as ground ivy and wild violets consider a better product such as T-zone.

4 hours is the usual window for being rainfast, many are pretty safe once dried.

Timing is important when applying herbicides, the best time is early Spring when weeds are actively growing and before the grass has ever been cut. The target weeds will have much more surface area absorbing the herbicide. Fall is also a good time for application as the plant will translocate the herbicide to the root.

Summer is pretty poor as the weeds will have a waxing coating and will not absorb the material well. As others have said, use a surfactant such as Li-700.

Must be Fall here as I got home this evening to a whole bunch of dead weeds. Amine was pretty easy to justify at $13/acre. I'm pleasantly surprised with the results but may up the game with a second round of something up the food chain. I'm beyond my seeding window already so the only decision at this point is when to aerate/fertilize or just use this year to go after the weeds. First frost here is in 4 weeks so not sure how best to use the time I've got left.
 

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Another way to speed absorption is to use a surfactant in the mix. That decreases the surface tension of the liquid so it "sticks" better and doesn't bead up and roll off the vegetation. I use a small squirt (about 10ml) of dishwashing liquid in the tank when I make my mix (25 gallons); just a few drops is all that's necessary for a 5 gallon hand spray tank.
Spoke to our local toxic waste, er, I mean herbicide expert about that. He said some dish soaps contain other chemicals that bind with the herbicide and inactivate it, so dish soap is not really a good idea. Surfactant is cheap and guaranteed not to interfere with the intended result.
 

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Interesting, thanks. Is there an example of a surfactant product to look for?
Generic from Tractor Supply seems to work fine, and so does what I got from Helena Chemical. But the commercial surfactant also contains some sort of stickum, or so it says. And I do notice my toxic waste sticks to the weeds a LOT better than it did with dish soap as the additive. (Easy to see cuz I use blue dye too.)
 
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