My Tractor Forum banner

1 - 13 of 13 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
325 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Unfortunately, we learned this the hard way.

My father called me at work to ask me what brand of chain saw got good ratings. I googled a few of the model numbers he gave me and came up with one that was decently rated with a decent price. He asked me to find out if it had an automatic chain oiler or not. In reading the online owners manual, I saw it said in large capital letters, "DO NOT USE MARINE OIL IN YOUR CHAINSAW!" I said, well hmmm, that's different, I thought 2 stroke oil was 2 stroke oil. I was wrong.

2 stroke marine oil is formulated for marine engines that are water cooled and operate at a much lower temp than air cooled chainsaw engines. Thus, their protection breaks down at high temps. You may use a TC-W3 oil but it must be the TM designated oil, which says its approved for air or water cooled engines. Otherwise, use ONLY API TC rated oil.

I know, since I was a little boy, my father would just pour some of his 2 stroke outboard oil into his chainsaws and he ALWAYS had issues with chainsaws and now he needs another one after using his brand new one only a few times, saying the engine is shot. I think I discovered why. I made sure he realized, in no uncertain terms, that he will keep buying new saws as long as he keeps trying to save money and use outboard oil in a chainsaw.

I wanted to pass this along to everyone, do not use outboard oil in your saw! Use the oil in the little bottles with the picture of the chainsaw on it. IT DOES MATTER.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
132 Posts
With more dilute ratios a better grade of oil can help.

Air cooled engines run hotter thus a poorer oil in an air cooled engine can be an issue.

Eons ago both small outboards and small air cooled 2 cycle engines recommended more oil per gallon of gas than current engines.

Our old British SeaGull outboard used 1:12;

our old Monkey Wards SeaKing outboard used 1:16.

A 1970's Homelite chain saw used a 1:20 ratio.

A dinky 2 Chrysler cycle 1000 watt generator from the 1970's used a 1:25 ratio.

A 1980's McCullough chain saw here used a 1:25 ratio; a 1980's weed eater used a 1:25 ratio.

Today many things like my 800 watt 2 cycle mention a 1:50 ratio; so does a 5 year old chain saw too.

Many better type modern 2 cycle oils today are better than eons ago; thus it is possible to use a more dilute ratio; *IF* one has a decent margin.

Here I actually use a premium synthetic 2 cycle Marine oil in all my 2 cycle engines with no issue too; even chain saws. I have doing this for a decade; thus really no so worried. The higher temperature breakdown temp of the synthetic allows this.

If in doubt just use what the makers recommends. Here I do not want to have all sorts of different cans of mixed 2 cycle gas; just a few.

With STIHL; they actually give a longer warranty if you use their oil.

You are correct that AIR cooled engines run hotter; thus a poorer grade marine oil might cause an oil failure. Here I use a premium synthetic that is actually a marine 2 cycle in all my 2 cycle stuff.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
132 Posts
It is conservative to say do not use a Marine 2 cycle oil in an aircooled 2 cycle engine; since many folks will just buy the cheapest marine 2 cycle oil; and not a premium type.

Thus it protects the bulk of folks and one does not have to explain why or provide exceptions; that folks can get confused about.

There are folks who actually use oil ratios of 1:100 in engines that say 1:50 because they use better oils. I do this with a tiny generator; it pollutes less, creates less smoke; uses less oil and I do it with marine 2 cycle in an air cooled engine; but it is a premium synthetic oil.

Bending the rules and doing acceptions voids warranties.
 

·
Just Have a Little Faith!
Joined
·
9,271 Posts
I was always puzzled by manufacturers who say if you do not use our brand of oil, use twice as much.
 

·
CalifornianGravelynator
Joined
·
4,330 Posts
Thanks for the info dwbh.
 

·
外人Geezer MTF Member
Joined
·
2,218 Posts
I have a Homelite chain saw I bought in 1977, small 10" bar model that I have used heavy and only used good quality oil. Get this - I was in a Stihl dealer about 5 years ago, and he told me I could use their 50:1 oil in my old saw with no problems. So, I figured, well, the thing is so old and was so cheap when I bought it, it wouldn't matter so much. Well, that has been about 5 years ago and the man was right! I have been using Stihl's 50:1 oil in all my saws and weed eater too, mixing it 50:1. I surely don't know why it works so good when my old Homelite recommends 16:1 gas/oil ratio! But it does...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3 Posts
I have a Homelite chain saw I bought in 1977, small 10" bar model that I have used heavy and only used good quality oil. Get this - I was in a Stihl dealer about 5 years ago, and he told me I could use their 50:1 oil in my old saw with no problems. So, I figured, well, the thing is so old and was so cheap when I bought it, it wouldn't matter so much. Well, that has been about 5 years ago and the man was right! I have been using Stihl's 50:1 oil in all my saws and weed eater too, mixing it 50:1. I surely don't know why it works so good when my old Homelite recommends 16:1 gas/oil ratio! But it does...
Because the oils today are of far higher quality today compared to when your saw was made. This would be especially true if the Stihl oil you were using was their HP Ultra synthetic.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
9,454 Posts
Manufacturer says to use such and such ratio. Why would one use anything else?

slomo
Again. the problem is having too many different fuel cans around with different ratios of fuel. The more you have, the more confusing it can be. Ever forget which one is which? :banghead3 Also, using one fuel can of mix goes faster, less chance of the fuel going stale, especially here in the north east where it is pretty much impossible to find non-ethanol gas.

I use my two stroke stuff little enough that I have switched to motomix in all of them. Hideously expensive, but it's supposed to last years without going bad. Plus, I don't have to remember which can is for the trimmer any more.:thThumbsU
 

·
Moderator
Joined
·
16,346 Posts
Steve--we used to have the same problem at work when I worked on the construction side of the business where I still work, and then in the shop.

Every foreman/super had his 'own' equipment, pre sec, on his truck--saws/blowers etc.--and all different brands/models--so many different cans of mix and gas and diesel.....and everyone using them/refilling, etc.

Lost several small engines that way......:duh::duh:
Solved part of the problem, by having a couple training classes and re-labeling old cans-and instructing field personal in proper use. Also went to new
(at the time) OPTI-2 mix, which solved all mix problems.

I, personally use Amsoil's 2-Cycle mix in everything, and have no problems up to now.

glenn
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,316 Posts
loaned a 2 stroke lawn boy to an inlaw ...and a can of "mixed" gas to go with it, told them to use it to fill up ... they used it on a weekend and called me on Sunday night... it wouldn't start .....

went back over and it was "seized" solid ... asked them where the can of mixed gas was ... "right over there , but we used our own gas" ... "what type of oil did you mix in it ?" ... " non , we never had to with the old mower " ....

labels on the machine said to mix oil ... I told them , even supplied the gas with oil in it .... Dumb as a bag of rocks ...

same thing happened with the "2 strokes" where I used to work ...
always set up the machines and mixed the fuel , labeled the cans , instructed the workers ... but someone would use straight gas .... chain saws, weed whackers, cement saws , etc ....

I put tags on the units saying " if it comes back broken , the person who signed it out is fired " ... they finally let 1 guy go and the rest smartened up.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
119 Posts
I was always puzzled by manufacturers who say if you do not use our brand of oil, use twice as much.
Probably because their brand is a synthetic while other brands may not be. You need to check the spec numbers of the oil to see if another brand is the same.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
298 Posts
Unfortunately, we learned this the hard way.

My father called me at work to ask me what brand of chain saw got good ratings. I googled a few of the model numbers he gave me and came up with one that was decently rated with a decent price. He asked me to find out if it had an automatic chain oiler or not. In reading the online owners manual, I saw it said in large capital letters, "DO NOT USE MARINE OIL IN YOUR CHAINSAW!" I said, well hmmm, that's different, I thought 2 stroke oil was 2 stroke oil. I was wrong.

2 stroke marine oil is formulated for marine engines that are water cooled and operate at a much lower temp than air cooled chainsaw engines. Thus, their protection breaks down at high temps. You may use a TC-W3 oil but it must be the TM designated oil, which says its approved for air or water cooled engines. Otherwise, use ONLY API TC rated oil.

I know, since I was a little boy, my father would just pour some of his 2 stroke outboard oil into his chainsaws and he ALWAYS had issues with chainsaws and now he needs another one after using his brand new one only a few times, saying the engine is shot. I think I discovered why. I made sure he realized, in no uncertain terms, that he will keep buying new saws as long as he keeps trying to save money and use outboard oil in a chainsaw.

I wanted to pass this along to everyone, do not use outboard oil in your saw! Use the oil in the little bottles with the picture of the chainsaw on it. IT DOES MATTER.
+1 agree with this 100%.

Oils are formulated for specific applications. They even print this out in plain English. If someone chooses to use Wesson oil and the saw locks up, who's at fault? Wesson or the moron?

Others use Wonder Fantastic oil in blanket applications. Okay...... I'll scoop it up off Craig's List for cheap. Seized up piston and all.

slomo
 
1 - 13 of 13 Posts
Top