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Will you get a readout monthly of power put back into grid?
 

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Discussion Starter #22 (Edited)
LOL - All that power and your camera batteries were dead. Just sounded funny to me.

Seriously I'm glad the system is working well for you. Do you know how much energy is being fed back to the PoCo?
Not exactly just yet, this is just the trial period, testing things out.

Will you get a readout monthly of power put back into grid?
But yes I will have a meter that tells me how much I'm using and how much power is going out to the grid.

Power Company is a little behind in installing the meters, should be sometime next week I'm told by my solar installer.

That is when we will really be going live.

Check out this video from years ago, prices have come down since video was filmed but ou will get the idea.

Works pretty much like this , net metering. I can monitor it on an app on my phone.

...
 

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Discussion Starter #24
No batteries I take it? They would keep you 'off grid' at night also.
No, no batteries. The solar company I went with doesn't offer them at this time. He says the technology just isn't there yet.

I think it's pretty costly too to add them too and we wanted to do this with as little money out of pocket as possible. So far we are pleased with the results.

Once they install the meters we will be able to see even better where things stand.

The reason our current meter doesn't spin backward like the video above is because the meter we have now is digital, not like the old style ones with the dial.

Our meter was read on the 4th of August. since we started this up just after that reading. I'm thinking we are going to see quite a difference in usage from last years bill next month to this years bill next month.
 

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No, no batteries... He says the technology just isn't there yet.
This is most definitely not the case, battery and charging technology has increased by leaps and bounds over the past several years. I'm currently typing this at 22:00+ under the light of stored sunshine... a very nice light too, LED tech has also exploded recently.

However.

I get what you're saying, re. cost etc...

ONE idea, that you could do with your present setup, and gradually expand, is to assemble a side "reserve backup" system. Collect some of your spare pixies during the day into a battery bank via a standard battery charger run off an outlet, and feed that into an inverter. Cost again yes, but as you build it and find ways to harness the free power I think you'd find it fun to play with. I started with about a 100w capacity and now have about 23 clean sine-wave amps on tap. Whether or not the Grid is spooling. So when the power goes out (not rare here on the Hill, up in the wooded mountains) I have the juice in hand to run the essentials for several hours *without* having to fire up the backup generator. This is distributed two ways: through the inverter to the house a/c wiring and also through a breakered, fused and independently wired 12v subsystem. The subsystem is online 24/7 and powers some strategically-placed lighting throughout the house (LED direct) and also some neat little gadgets like bedside USB charging. So it always works, no matter what.

Batteries and their care and feeding is a whole 'nother thread, but right now at 22:30 the display on my desktop is telling me the system is currently at 12.8~9 volts. Not bad at all.

Fun stuff... :tango_face_glasses:

Nice panels you've got there, own 'em. :trink39:
 

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Discussion Starter #26
Batteries and their care and feeding is a whole 'nother thread, but right now at 10:30 the display on my desktop is telling me the system is currently at 12.8~9 volts. Not bad at all.

Fun stuff... :tango_face_glasses:

Nice panels you've got there, own 'em. :trink39:
Can you really tell by looking at the panels the make of them?

I have been reading a little bit about the batteries. The care of them has me scared, like they can go bad over time even when you don't use them.

Our power doesn't really go off that often anyway and we do still have a back up generator if need be run the fridge, freezer and a few lights if need be. For now that will have to do until battery power comes down in price and is better advanced.
 

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I can't tell the exact make from here of course, but your standard photovoltaic panel is pretty tried and true anymore and it's hard to get bad ones these days, and at 300w a pop that's a very impressive array.

Most batteries die an early death from ignorance. Mostly manifested as repeated over-discharge, and failure to properly equalize from time to time. *Especially* when you don't use them. There's the whole thing of number of charge cycles yada yada but if you don't kill 'em dead each time it's not really a thing.

A battery primer and introductory reading: https://www.emarineinc.com/Batteries-Maintenance-101
 

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Think of it like this... you've got a tractor that uses oil. Perfect except for that one thing, nice and strong. So you can run it either of two ways: flog it until the oil is almost gone, and then refill without ever changing it, OR keep it full and change it regularly.

Under which scenario will the engine last longer?

Same with batteries.
 

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Discussion Starter #29
Here are more pictures of the set up. Can just barely see the edge of the panel from the front yard on the main house, the 2 inverters, 1 controls 32 panels and the other one controls the other 31 panels. Shows the gap between the panels and the shingles. Plus you can see the total roof now including the 10 panels on the garage.

The pool is a salt water pool also, only needed 2 bags of salt to open it up this year plus one bottle of stabilizer.........No chlorine of any kind used or even shock. Run the filter and salt generator about 8 hours a day.

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My daughter bought a house not too far from you about two years ago. it came with 47 panels on the roof, which were installed around 2012. Looking at your inverters, I can see there has been quite a bit of miniaturization over the years. Her inverters are about four times as large, and there are three of them. Apparently there is no maintenance on the system. I'm sure you will appreciate that.

BTW, nice house and property you have there. :fing32:
 

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Discussion Starter #32
My daughter bought a house not too far from you about two years ago. it came with 47 panels on the roof, which were installed around 2012. Looking at your inverters, I can see there has been quite a bit of miniaturization over the years. Her inverters are about four times as large, and there are three of them. Apparently there is no maintenance on the system. I'm sure you will appreciate that.

BTW, nice house and property you have there. :fing32:
Thanks! Yes we like it out where we live, everyone has a little over an acre lot. So no one is right on top of each other.

My installer said not to many years ago our system would have cost about $100,000............Prices have come way down and the equipment has really went high tech.

Only real maintenance I have to do is keep an eye on the readings of each panel just to make sure they are all operating correctly. With the app on the phone and my home computer I can see what each panel is producing at all times. He said if you see panels next to each other with totals not that close in output then you have a potential problem and I am to call him.

Also there are 3 lights on the inverters to watch. 1 means it is running properly, 1 blinks when the totals are sent to the monitoring web site and the other is when there is a fault of some kind. If I see the fault light go on I am to turn the power off and then back on to reset it. If that doesn't work I am then suppose to call him and he can talk me through resetting it, if that doesn't work they send someone out.
 

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Discussion Starter #33
Look into the new solar wall type battery offered by Tesla. Supposed to be the latest and greatest at a better price than conventional batteries. Or so the Hype goes.

No idea if the hype matches reality.

All sounds interesting until you get to the part about the cost and that the batteries will not last forever.


Tesla Powerwall: the complete review


In 2015, automaker Tesla Motors set its sights on the home energy storage market and announced the launch of its home battery pack, the Tesla Powerwall.

In the past, Tesla Motors has been praised for making high-quality electric vehicles, as well as for their ability to reimagine and successfully rebrand existing technologies. In fact, while Tesla's automobiles revitalized the 21st-century electric vehicle market, the first electric cars were invented more than a hundred years earlier.

Tesla’s rebranding of residential-use batteries is in line with their legacy of reimagining existing products. The Tesla Powerwall may represent the first time in history that everyday homeowners are truly excited about the potential of storing energy at their home.

What is the Tesla Powerwall?

Tesla describes the Powerwall as a “rechargeable lithium ion battery with liquid thermal control.” It is one of a few companies in the residential energy storage market that makes small-scale batteries for home energy storage. The first-generation Powerwall launched in April 2015, and an updated Powerwall 2.0 was announced in October 2016. The Powerwall 2.0 is priced at $5,500.

Tesla battery packs are an ideal pairing for solar panel systems, especially in the case of off-grid projects where homeowners need or want to become fully independent of their utility. A solar storage solution like the Tesla Powerwall allows you to maintain a sustained power supply during the day or night. But how does Tesla’s battery pack measure up against all the other home energy storage options? Read on to learn more about Tesla Powerwall’s cost, technology, and warranty coverage.

tesla powerwall cost
How does Tesla's battery work?

Tesla and other electric carmakers have invested a significant amount of time and money into developing long-lasting battery technology. An enduring concern of American car buyers is that electric vehicles don't hold enough charge, and that they could be left stranded along the roadside as a result. While Tesla’s research into battery technology was initially focused on the auto market, manufacturing a Tesla battery pack for home use is another way for the company to bring its existing inventions to market.

As with other energy storage products, the Tesla battery pack is sized for day-to-day use at your home, and is usually paired with a home solar panel system. When your solar panels produce more electricity than you can use in your home, the excess is stored in the battery pack instead of being sent back into the electric grid. Later, when your panels aren’t producing enough electricity, you can use the electricity stored in your Powerwall instead of having to buy it from your utility.


Normally, this process happens over the course of a day: when the sun is high in the sky and your solar panels are producing more electricity than you can use, the surplus energy is stored in your Tesla Powerwall. As the sun goes down and your solar panel production decreases, you draw on the electricity that you stored during the sunniest part of the day. Essentially, the Powerwall helps you balance out your electricity production and usage over the course of the day.

Can you go "off the grid" with a Tesla Powerwall and solar?
Installing a solar-plus-storage system at your home is a great way to take control of your electricity bill, but it doesn’t mean that you’re completely disconnected from your utility. Going "off the grid" with solar batteries is actually a more expensive and complicated proposition than you might think. A single Tesla home battery will only provide backup power for a few hours – not nearly enough to cover you if you have an entirely cloudy day, let alone several days or weeks of inclement weather.

What is the Tesla Powerwall warranty, and how long does the battery last?

The Powerwall comes with an unlimited 10-year warranty that assumes your battery is used for daily charging and draining. However, Tesla does not currently offer any coverage related to how much capacity the battery will lose during that time.

Tesla’s battery technology is similar to other rechargeable batteries both large and small: as time goes on, the battery loses some of its ability to hold a charge. Think of how the battery life of a brand-new smartphone compares to one that is a few years old. As you continually charge and drain your phone’s battery, it starts to lose some of its ability to hold a charge.

Tesla battery life will deteriorate in the same way. That isn’t an indicator of a product flaw – all batteries lose some of their ability to hold a charge over time, whether it’s an electric vehicle battery, a home energy battery, or a rechargeable AA battery. However, many of the other solar batteries for home use that are on the market do come with warranties that guarantee a certain amount of storage capacity.

While the warranty isn’t the only criterion to evaluate when choosing a solar battery for your home, it should be one factor under consideration when making an investment in solar-plus-storage.

How much does the Tesla Powerwall cost? :eek:mg:


The cost of the equipment for a new Tesla Powerwall 2.0 battery is $5,500, which includes a built-in inverter and twice the storage capacity of the original Powerwall battery. By comparison, the list price for a first-generation Powerwall without an inverter was $3,500. In order to install the battery, you would have also needed a separate, specially made inverter that can communicate between your solar panel system, your battery, and the electric grid.

List prices don't take the cost of installation labor into account. According to the Tesla website, installing a Tesla Powerwall battery pack will typically add anywhere from $800 to $2,000 to the list price. However, this estimate doesn't include the cost of electrical upgrades (if necessary), taxes, permit fees, or connection charges. EnergySage users have reported receiving installation quotes that are significantly higher than Tesla's estimate, and the final price tag will be dependent on the specifics of your installation.

If you want to install the Powerwall as part of a solar-plus-storage system, battery costs are just one part of the equation. An average 5 kilowatt (kW) solar energy system costs anywhere from $8,500 to $16,000 depending on where you live and the type of equipment you choose. That may sound like a lot of money, but installing a solar-plus-storage system can be a worthwhile investment. Solar battery economics depend on a few different factors. Whether or not the Tesla battery pack makes sense for you depends on the way that your electric utility structures its rates, as well as your reasons for installing a solar battery.

Should you install a Tesla Powerwall or other solar battery?
Solar batteries are a fairly new technology for homeowners. While they offer significant benefits for some, they aren’t always a necessary investment. If your utility offers net metering, installing a solar battery won’t save you money. However, if you install a solar panel system in an area with time-of-use (TOU) electricity rates, no net metering, or significant demand charges, a solar battery could be a good choice for you.

Where to buy the Tesla Powerwall

While there has been a significant amount of “buzz” around the Tesla Powerwall battery, the product is not yet available to the mass market. The company manufactured a few hundred Powerwalls and put them on the market after the product launch in 2015, but availability is now limited. Tesla home batteries won’t be available to the mass market until the company’s large battery factory (known as the Gigafactory) is finished in 2017.

Whether you want to install a Tesla Powerwall or other home battery pack, you will most likely need to work through a certified installer. Adding energy storage technology to your home is a complicated process that requires electrical expertise, certifications, and knowledge of the best practices required to install a solar-plus-storage system correctly.

A qualified EnergySage-approved company can give you the best recommendation about the Tesla home battery and other energy storage options available to homeowners today. If you are interested in receiving competing installation quotes for solar and energy storage options from local installers near you, simply join the EnergySage Solar Marketplace today and indicate what products you’re interested in your profile’s preferences section.
 

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Looks good, Jim. Good luck with it and hope it works well for you.
 

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Discussion Starter #35
Someone in the back field checking out our solar panels.

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WOW, must not be much hunting by you. I have never seen a group of bucks like that around here.
 

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Discussion Starter #37
WOW, must not be much hunting by you. I have never seen a group of bucks like that around here.

Saw 2 bucks and 2 doe's the night before those 4 bucks were seen............Didn't get home in time tonight before dark to see how many were out there tonight.

It's about 125 yards into a farmer's field from the edge of our property to where these bucks were seen. Then there is about another 150 yards of dense woods with a stream going through it. Then a road with a lot of cars going by on it......and across the road from that is another farmer's field......so not a lot of hunting in the piece of woods because a there are a bunch of houses in our neighbor hood that back up to this field. Have never really heard any gun shots from here back there.
 

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I only see bucks in December/January when the doe are in season... (not meaning hunting "season")
 

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Discussion Starter #39
Just wanted to update the solar project totals.

Some had asked how many kWh we are sending out to the grid.

Just got the Nov Monthly Statement:

Usage In was 1147 kWh's

Usage Out to the grid was 1057 KWh's

Meaning we are getting charged for using 90 kWh's

2016 November bill last year $297.00

2017 November bill this year $15.62


So it's going quite well :)
 

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I just saw another story on the evils of solar and how it's hurting power companies to buy it from lowly homeowners. And how they may be adding new fees and taxes to help out the suffering utilities. More might get too political for this board, so I'll hush now.
 
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