[Honda_Chuck]

Honda 4514.. I bought it new. in 1992

other day while cutting grass. the engine made a loud squealing sound. then locked up. like 3 seconds.

turns out the water pump locked up and moved the pump pulley outward into the back of the flywheel. locking up the engine. and destroying the timing belt. and there was NO coolant (water) lost. dry as a bone.

ordered replacement parts. and waiting for delivery .

I could not find this failure on the internet. so I am reporting it..

later I will stop back and check out this forum.

Thank You . Chuck

p.s. how do I change my login name? fat fingers and all.

 

[larryccf]

any chance you can post a shot? - water pump sits above the flywheel so i'm not sure what you're describing

 

[Honda_Chuck]

I do not have digital photo stuff..

the shaft of the water pump with the pulley moved outward (about 1/4 inch) and hit the back side of the flywheel edge near the starter teeth on the flywheel.

locking the engine.. had to unbolt all 4 water pump bolts to get it to release flywheel.

the water pump is NOT above the flywheel.. only part of it is.

the water pump pulley near the block has the belt teeth and there is a Nose on the pulley that is over the flywheel .. the nose missed the flywheel and the wider part hit the flywheel.

 

[Honda_Chuck]

http://i816.photobucket.com/albums/zz81/vze86qtl/flywheel3.jpg

I cut this photo from another post here...to show the water pump pulley, See the nose sticks out past the flywheel. and the Face of the pulley hit the back of the flywheel, locking the engine.

 

[larryccf]

I do not have digital photo stuff..

the shaft of the water pump with the pulley moved outward (about 1/4 inch) and hit the back side of the flywheel edge near the starter teeth on the flywheel.

locking the engine.. had to unbolt all 4 water pump bolts to get it to release flywheel.

the water pump is NOT above the flywheel.. only part of it is.

the water pump pulley near the block has the belt teeth and there is a Nose on the pulley that is over the flywheel .. the nose missed the flywheel and the wider part hit the flywheel.

here's the reason i stated the water pump sits ABOVE the flywheel -

to my eye the waterpump is sitting above the flywheel - from the above picture, only a very small portion of the waterpump PULLEY is sitting behind the flywheel which is why your initial description confused me. I knew i had adjusted the tension on my timing belt with the flywheel on, prying against the flywheel to push the waterpump over.

You might try being a little more accurate in your responses in the future, and a little less confrontational............. or not, you choose.

I don't think anyone has posted a waterpump failure, so having yours does give us one failure mode to be aware of - tks for that.

and btw, that photo you borrowed was from one of my posts

 

[Honda_Chuck]

I stand corrected.. but I had to remove the flywheel to get the water pump out.. as the pulley was jammed behind the flywheel. so water pump pulley is behind. Must be old school vers. new school. I am a retired auto mechanic.

That is why I posted this information. I could not find one report of this happening on a internet search.. and that is how I found this place.

 

[Honda_Chuck]

my high school diploma is dated 1970..

and computer stuff.. I copied a photo and when I pasted it (see above), it did NOT display..???
but your photo did display.. old school vers. new school . but I am slowly learning...

 

[TUDOR]

to my eye the waterpump is sitting above the flywheel - from the above picture, only a very small portion of the waterpump PULLEY is sitting behind the flywheel which is why your initial description confused me. I knew i had adjusted the tension on my timing belt with the flywheel on, prying against the flywheel to push the waterpump over.

You might try being a little more accurate in your responses in the future, and a little less confrontational............. or not, you choose.

I don't think anyone has posted a waterpump failure, so having yours does give us one failure mode to be aware of - tks for that.

and btw, that photo you borrowed was from one of my posts

Semantics. The pump housing casting incorporates the pulley. The internals for the pump may be above the flywheel, but the pump housing casting is also behind the flywheel. It's one piece from the pics and its all part of the water pump.

You're both right.

Chuck, I reported your post re. the "fat fingers" to higher authority. Hopefully you will get a PM in the near future.

 

[Honda_Chuck]

Semantics. The pump housing casting incorporates the pulley. The internals for the pump may be above the flywheel, but the pump housing casting is also behind the flywheel. It's one piece from the pics and its all part of the water pump.

You're both right.

Chuck, I reported your post re. the "fat fingers" to higher authority. Hopefully you will get a PM in the near future.

Thank You, Sir, and also for your help.

and yes the pulley does NOT come off the water pump..

I just wanted others to know about this problem. before they trash a good engine .. and only needs a water pump and a belt.

 

[black88mx6]

Thanks for the info Chuck. I have replaced my timing belt, but not my water pump. Good to know they can lock up the engine. Also nice to see another Honda tractor running in Ohio.

 

[Honda_Chuck]

Thanks for the info Chuck. I have replaced my timing belt, but not my water pump. Good to know they can lock up the engine. Also nice to see another Honda tractor running in Ohio.

just trying to help..

got mine in spring of 1992.. except for plugs, oil and filter and a couple of batteries.. it been Great.

last summer I found a NOS 38 inch deck .. in upper New York.. from a Honda dealer.. good price also.

I may install it after putting engine back together... my 42 inch is rusting badly.

 

[Honda_Chuck]

its back,

received the new parts on Friday night,
today (Monday) I install and assembled everything.

it was raining out but cut grass for 5 minutes.. just to make sure its 100 percent again.

I am going to look into a digital camera (cheap).
must be 200 camera's. I guess I will flip a coin.
so I hope to show the pump pulley and the bent impeller shaft.
and belt teeth stuck to the pulley.

Thank You for the information here, Chuck

 

[Honda_Chuck]

pulley face that hit the flywheel




belt missing teeth



bent impeller shaft




my first time with a digital camera and POSTing on the internet..

please comment...

 

[dmac601]

Great job with the digital photos

 

[Honda_Chuck]

pulley face 002 by Chuck_Honda, on Flickr

 

[mogman8]

so, I just picked up an HT3813 and while cranking it over to get it started, the same thing happened to me. The water pump pulley slipped less than a quarter inch off it's shaft and rubbed on the flywheel thus locking up the engine (never even got it started at this point). So after reading above, it sounds like the water pump pulley is not meant to come off it's shaft? Can I just hammer the pulley back onto the shaft or is a water pump replacement a must? I gave it a couple taps with a hammer and the engine turns freely again...

 

[Honda_Chuck]

.
it will do it again.. replace pump... on mine.. the bearing on the pump locked up and bent the shaft.
.
.

 

[john6185]

I'm learning as I read, I've had my 4514 since '98 and have used it every year to mow and this year I find it isn't charging the battery plus, I deduced from this thread that the seepage that isn't oil coming from the rear housing is from the water pump. May as well change the belt also since I'm sure it's never been changed. So thanks posters! Where do you folks buy the belt and water pump for these old 4514's?

 

[Honda_Chuck]

https://planopower.com/product-category/honda/

or boats.net...

having to remove engine... timing belt, water pump, charging coil.. maybe spark plug coil...

I have replace 3 of the 4... charging coil is still original.