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Subsurface dweller
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194 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Well, I have this old Jake 1200 Chief...



Had it for about 15 years now (as well as several other Jakes). This one never got much use by me. It is a bit rougher than the pic shows. It got pushed into a corner in the barn about 8 years ago and there it rested. It ran OK the last I had used it. Tried to thin things down and sell it on Craigslist... no takers. Not even a call. Guess it'll have to stay there a bit longer.

Then along came this...



It is a little wrangled but not bad. I believe a Johnson from a Cub cadet. Hmmm...says I. I tried to see if that would go on a Gravely 8122 I have that is not getting much use. No... too many hand controls. How about My Wheel Horse C161A... no. That thing mows way too well and again, too many hand controls with the hydro. Well now... what about that ol' 1200 Chief over there under the tarp?
Pulled it out, threw some gas down the carb throat and cranked it over with a jumper. What'll you know... it fired and ran the gas out. OK. I'll take that as a yes. This tractor will get this loader!
Barring any real complications, this should be a fit. I'll post some pics along the way but don't get antsy... I work slooooow.
First order of business will be addressing the steering. I have modified my Wheel Horse and the results were wonderful lightening fast steering with minimal effort. I dare say it ended up way faster than power steering, far simpler, and about same effort unburdened. We will initially apply the same mods to this Jake, especially tossing that hippie van steering wheel! Maybe first up will be speeding up the '68+ style steering (what this tractor has and other Chiefs with the stamped footrests) to the ratio of the '66 tractors (or the models with cast footrests).
We'll see what happens. I gaurantee... there'll be some wheels on the front that'll be pretty strange!
 

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Looks like it'll be a great project, I'll be keeping my eye on this for sure :fing32:
 

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Super Moderator
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I realize you said the Jake didn't look as good as pictured but it does sure look complete. Can't imagine no interest from Craigslist! Good luck mounting up the loader!
 

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Plain Old MTF Member
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216 Posts
I did some "digging" and found that two different loader manufacturers made them for use
on Jacobsen tractors. One is Danuser Machine Works. They made two all purpose loaders,
No. JC675 and JC625. The other is Johnson Hydraulic Equip. which made the Workhorse Loader No. 10 Your loader looks good. I take it that it is the No.10? Good luck with the project.
 

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Subsurface dweller
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194 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
The Jake is missing all the little stuff enthusiasts look for to restore... the side expanded metal side panels, the upper grill bezel and headlights, the lift has been cannibalized, the seat back is driven forward, steering wheel incorrect, harness a real mess, the engine is a whole different variety. It is a K301 but set up for magneto ignition and pan mounted dipstick. There is next to no way to check oil short of removing the air cleaner assembly and using an long 12pt socket to unscrew the square sided plug. I do not know how well fix that. I had converted it to run on coil ignition but the mag is still there...perhaps I should drill a second spark plug hole and have dual ignition!
Did run it some tonight and it ran all on its own and very well. The memory has faded however. I remember now why I parked it. The rod is knocking on acceleration. Well daggummit. I'll pull the motor down and see if any crank issues and if OK, throw a new rod in there.
Neil J, I believe the Danuser unit is a trip loader...the bucket has no hydraulics. I think the Johnson #10 had a single cylinder with scissor links for bucket roll. The Johnson #14 did not have the self leveling bucket feature I think. So this is somewhere between. It has the twin bucket cylinders with self leveling links parallel atop the main beams. It is a very popular unit and I have seen them on a lot of Sears like the one on eBay now...



The main towers are universal... whichever side you want the reservoir, simply un-pin it and swap them.
I have a few alterations in mind. We will need rear ballast so I just might relocate the battery and fuel tanks behind seat. Would be tough filling the tank in the standard location with the Jake car style hood. I would mount up a large size auto battery since this then would be a "jumper" service vehicle to help my other dead junk get started.
Oh well. We'll first see how the engine looks.
 

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Subsurface dweller
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194 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
Whooopsie! I got that all wrong and backward! This appears to be a KwikWay loader... NOT a Johnson! I don't think Johnson used this self leveling feature. Sorry if that cornfused anybody. Got them all mixed up.
 

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Plain Old MTF Member
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216 Posts
We all "whoopsie" once in a while!
I would love to gather all technical and optional info on the 60's Chiefs. If I post an assumption, I will state it as such. What I mean is to gather info from publications and include the publication number. Jacobsen used "part" numbers instead of "publication" numbers on literature. When I get time I will list ALL the options and implements on the Chiefs. Is there/could be there a "fact page" to click on in this forum which is info submitted from such publications?
 

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Subsurface dweller
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194 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
Well, just as Aardvark161 gets his Jake bcak together, we've torn one up. It didn't look too bad before I started this endeavor...



But soon a kanock was detected and the engine put on the disabled list. There are several other changes I would make (mentioned earlier) so some disassembly required...



That white weldment is the subframe that the loader mounts to. I think it is originally a JD application though the aft enda has been cut to adapt it to something else. If that's true, this will make the third tractor this has been fitted to! The loader saddles on the tubular cross member. Just eyeballing things out here.
But, that kanock needs a looking after...



Long ago in the big ag tractor world (and other heavy equipment) this would be similar to an IFO ( "in-frame overhaul")!
Aaaaww daggummit. The crank is shot! Journal is good looking but way way under, .002 out of round, .002" taper. Kaput.
Looks like we need to think of alternative power or investigate a replacement crank/rod. I surely hate to put a Chinese motor in here. Need to go shake the bushes.
While we try to sort the motor, we can still look at the loader mounting and some steering mods to easy the effort when/if the front is burdened.
 

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Plain Old MTF Member
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216 Posts
Wow...Another piece of history being brought back to life! I would hate to see a "cheap"
engine put on that frame! In fact...an old Kohler that knocks would be better!
Although I have considered putting a new Hatz 10hp diesel on an old Jake, but they
are NOT cheap! Post some pics along the way!
 

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Subsurface dweller
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194 Posts
Discussion Starter #10 (Edited)
For sure we'll post gobs of pics and updates. It will get done and there may be a bunch of "over the top fabrication" done. I have full access to a very well equipped machine shop and that is my occupation. I wouldn't expect anybody to duplicate some things I have planned, but it may be interesting to watch!
I have, at the moment, two or three NOS Wisconsin motors available to me. Very inexpensive but I think 10hp and they are pump motors. That means no long crank output end. Frankly, I could still use that since I will not need the power drive PTO any longer. I could easily turn up from solid, a double vee sheave that would provide drive for tranny and a second groove for pump. A swinging pump mount or a clutching idler could be added so pump doesn't drag during starting. Just some thoughts. It might be simplest to get the crank pin ground -.020" and get one of those special rods. The big thing that annoys me about keeping this engine block is there is no upper dipstick. I had tried to make one years ago (the long yellow t handle you see) but it would hit something internal. The Kohler supplied dipstick (can be seen in the last pic) is on the base flange of block and can be used at front or aft flange. The front is blocked by starter/gen and the aft...well, you know how crowded it is back there!
Stand by.
 

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Deere 330 Killer
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17,892 Posts
I thought sears loaders were kwik-way??????????
 

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grind the crank, for a pump I would use a vane pump, no load on start-up until it gets to about 300rpm, then it will start pumping, nice thing about them is they really just circulate the oil at a minimum even at speed until a load is called upon them. Oh and they are quiet too;)
 

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Subsurface dweller
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194 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
grind the crank, for a pump I would use a vane pump, no load on start-up until it gets to about 300rpm, then it will start pumping, nice thing about them is they really just circulate the oil at a minimum even at speed until a load is called upon them. Oh and they are quiet too;)

I am at the moment considering grinding the crank pin. The hesitation I have is the crank pin measures a low of 1.4844" to a high of 1.4891" in diameter. The crank pin would have to go a minimum of -.020" under which Kohler did not sell parts for. Hot rodders have -.020" rods available (and even -.030") and yes, they may have success with them. I do not know whether they are using a domestically supplied part to modify to make these or whether they are modifying old ones, the provenance is unknown. Having some experience with aluminum die casting (the process that the rod I have was made with) they are likely A390 alloy when Kohler made them. If Stens is buying these from China or where ever (there is a reason they are 1/3 the cost of a Kohler rod), what alloy are they using? I may be worrying over nothing, but I just talked yesterday with a small engine overhauler who was adamant that there is only one rod for a K301. He went on to inform me that he overhauls these engines for a living. Clearly, there are two types of long dipper rods listed in Kohler parts list for a K301 and these are based upon the serial (which is long missing on this motor and unknown to me). So...who do you believe? The Kohler service manual may shed light upon that as it describes two differing fasteners on the rod cap: Capscrews or studs and Posilock nuts. The existing rod is of little help since the number on it matches none of the Kohler numbers in the K301 parts list. The fellow may be correct...they interchange. I will see and remain "buyer beware".
I will have to contact my cranker grinder and further inspect the pin. It is possible that the diameter will not clean up at -.020" if the diameter I am reading the smallest number is not concentric with the design throw distance (1/2 stroke). There is but a hair over .004 stock and may take a careful set up. Otherwise, it would have to go -.030". We will have to see.

RE: pump. The loader came with a nice compact gear pump. we will attempt to use it first.
 

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Subsurface dweller
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194 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
While we're deciding the fate of the powerplant, lessee here...




This locating is heavily based upon the dimensions used by Sears for mounting the same KW loader to a mid-70's SS/16T. The Sears has approximately 43" WB and the frame is 25" aft of front wheel c/l and bottom of sub-frame cross tube is 8" off floor.
I would like to keep the aft position since I think it would be handy to have a short OAL (I do not plan on loading trucks and such). I also would like to gain as high a ground clearance. So I figured since the Jake appears to have perhaps an inch shorter wheel base so I pulled the frame forward a bit. The paint cans a tad under 8". I still have a goodly amount of clearance under frame of tractor so could raise perhaps 1" or more. I am dedicating this tractor to this loader so I look to omit the lift lever/quadrant (this is no permanent damage to tractor. The parts get hung on the wall and can go back on if needed). This raising of the sub-frame interferes with the foot rests. You can see in the above pic, I have slid the rest aft so the bend relief notch is now saddled on the cross bar. This flattens the rest more to horizontal, but I have found this ergonomically no issue with Gravely riders so we'll look at relocating them here. I have a ratty old spare set of rests that can get an extra set of holes.

Here's another perspective...



A lot of options are opening up. I removed the forward attachment "hook" as I will not be needing that. I am going to aim the forward half of the sub-frame at those four bolt holes to distribute as much load as possible to the front and rear of tractor frame to avoid hanging loads amidships. I think where this is headed we may very well end up with a second frame below the tractor frame from stem to stern. We can create a Warren truss type structure.

Stay tuned! :)
 

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Subsurface dweller
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Discussion Starter #16
Well, looks like this party's over before it started.
To top the poor crankshaft we decided it wise to inspect one of the weakest links in the Jacobsen Chief drive train... the direction reverser gear box. That is that strange little round gear box on the input shaft of the trans axle. I've had my dealings with these doodads before, not an easy thing to deal with. They are so so often forgotten and neglected.
Oil? We don't need no stinkin' oil!...





Having been in the machine business for so long, I have come to the realization that there is not much that cannot be salvaged. But there is the time/cost/result factor. To salvage those gears, we would have to weld up four bearing surfaces and re-grind off centers. I can get all the bearings and seals and make the gasket and the castings are sound. But the input to the trans would have to come out for re-work and I ain't splitting that axle!
So we'll drop this tractor right there. Maybe a gear box will show up on eBay.

A word to those who have gear drive Chiefs...look at that wretched little box. It is unique to Jacobsen (since they put the engine in the wrong way!) so they are hard to find. It can be a deal breaker.
 
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