New stairs problem?!? - MyTractorForum.com - The Friendliest Tractor Forum and Best Place for Tractor Information
My Place Pics and stories about your home and property

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 16 Old 07-16-2019, 07:19 PM Thread Starter
Senior MTF Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Va.
Posts: 336
New stairs problem?!?

This is weird. I'm having a barn built, and to get to lower level I had pressure treated stairs put in with a 4x4ft landing at top (My idea). Two posts were augered in. One stair stringer is attached to a retaining wall. I told them I'll need to dig down then use scrap 2x6s treated on two sides so I can backfill it, walk over to deck.
I just backhoed and raked it and the one post is 30" long sitting on dirt! Shouldn't it be augered in?
I haven't made final payment, and wonder what to do. Can I drill a hole beside it, attach post to it (parallel)? All along I've been helping, doing some of the work, but although it seems sturdy now, it can't be right.

Sent from my SM-S320VL using Tapatalk
Sevenhills1952 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 16 Old 07-16-2019, 08:39 PM
Proud Member of the 1K Club
 
Kubota Ronin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Japan
Posts: 1,227
Re: New stairs problem?!?

They should all be in concrete footings.

I don't always post on the internet. But when I do, I prefer MTF.

Kubota AMX-3
Shibaura LT16B

Kubota Ronin is online now  
post #3 of 16 Old 07-16-2019, 09:40 PM
Still lovin' the 322!
 
PA318Guy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 24,959
Barn
Re: New stairs problem?!?

Yep they made a mistake and tried to get away with it! Call them on it and have them make it right before you pay!

Current Machine JD 322

Former Machines: JD 318, JD 216, JD 212, 1965 JD 110



My videos: www.youtube.com/user/tkelley16341

Where the Colonel got Oil instead of Chicken!!
PA318Guy is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 16 Old 07-16-2019, 10:05 PM
Parts collector
 
mopar65pa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Manheim PA
Posts: 2,264
Re: New stairs problem?!?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pa318guy View Post
yep they made a mistake and tried to get away with it! Call them on it and have them make it right before you pay!
x2!

Been driving Deeres since 1974, Dodges since 1984, and Davidsons since 2004. Love my wife and kids I'm a blessed man.

1970 140 H1
1977 300 H2
1983 314 H1 for sale
110 parts tractor for sale
198? 332 50" deck
300 series #33 tiller
Single piston dirt/snow plow
piston lift snow blower
Hand made pintle hitch
Bradley plow, harrow, and disc.
mopar65pa is offline  
post #5 of 16 Old 07-17-2019, 04:25 AM
20,000 Posts & Climbing
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Sault Ste Marie, Ontario
Posts: 21,005
Re: New stairs problem?!?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kubota Ronin View Post
They should all be in concrete footings.
It has been discovered that concrete will rot construction grade lumber over a period of 40 years or so. That's one reason why the construction practice now is to lay a 1/8" foam sheet barrier between the concrete foundation and the wood structure of a house.

When the wood is also in contact with the moist ground, the rot happens over a somewhat shorter time. Apparently, it's the combination of moisture and the lime in the concrete that attacks the wood.

Bob

Click for The Hydraulics Forum!

Sometimes you get on a roll, sometimes the roll gets on you.

In Service
MF GC2310, Husqvarna YTH20B42T

Down for Repairs
MF1655 w/ FEL, MF1655, MF12H, MF8H, MF7H
Spending too much time on MTF to work on my toys.
TUDOR is offline  
post #6 of 16 Old 07-17-2019, 04:34 AM
Proud Member of the 1K Club
 
Kubota Ronin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Japan
Posts: 1,227
Re: New stairs problem?!?

I've heard that one, never seen it happen... but then again I'm still a young pup.

I'd rather that anyhow than have the posts rot quicker, or begin their inevitable journey to the center of the Earth.

Over here the footings are often pre-cast and sunk but designed to protrude above-ground, then the posts are bolted to hardware cast into the top of the things.

I don't always post on the internet. But when I do, I prefer MTF.

Kubota AMX-3
Shibaura LT16B

Kubota Ronin is online now  
post #7 of 16 Old 07-17-2019, 05:33 AM
20,000 Posts & Climbing
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Sault Ste Marie, Ontario
Posts: 21,005
Re: New stairs problem?!?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kubota Ronin View Post
Over here the footings are often pre-cast and sunk but designed to protrude above-ground, then the posts are bolted to hardware cast into the top of the things.
Same idea here, but the post bases are galvanized bent sheet metal mounted with an anchor bolt in the concrete. The base puts an air space between the concrete and the post to keep moisture away.

I pulled the rotted remains of 2x4s out of the basement floor that had been used to screed the concrete 38 years previously when I remodeled a house 17 years ago. Had to hand mix a bag of concrete mix to fill the slots. Won't be doing that again with my back!!

Bob

Click for The Hydraulics Forum!

Sometimes you get on a roll, sometimes the roll gets on you.

In Service
MF GC2310, Husqvarna YTH20B42T

Down for Repairs
MF1655 w/ FEL, MF1655, MF12H, MF8H, MF7H
Spending too much time on MTF to work on my toys.

Last edited by TUDOR; 07-17-2019 at 05:43 AM.
TUDOR is offline  
post #8 of 16 Old 07-17-2019, 06:19 AM
Proud Member of the 1K Club
 
Kubota Ronin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Japan
Posts: 1,227
Re: New stairs problem?!?

I think we're on the same page... on both counts. Funny some of the stuff you run across fixing up old places/someone else's... (PC term) "mistakes". I could write a book on some of the "interesting" stuff I've found fixing up this place.

Reminds me it's past time to update the 'Bota thread, but I haven't taken a whole lot of pictures of late... hard to do with all three hands full...

EDIT: If the Colonies are using that type of footer/footing now too (as opposed to the Sonotube of old) then my original reply should be "on" concrete footing.

I don't always post on the internet. But when I do, I prefer MTF.

Kubota AMX-3
Shibaura LT16B


Last edited by Kubota Ronin; 07-17-2019 at 06:41 AM.
Kubota Ronin is online now  
post #9 of 16 Old 07-17-2019, 09:31 AM
Senior MTF Member
 
spokes100's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: CNY USA
Posts: 751
Re: New stairs problem?!?

stone base, concrete tube, metal post holder, lot of work but seems to work
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	pix 2.jpg
Views:	10
Size:	226.1 KB
ID:	2386935  

spokes100 is offline  
post #10 of 16 Old 07-17-2019, 10:17 AM
15,000 +posts!
 
Tractor-Holic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: MA
Posts: 19,237
Re: New stairs problem?!?

A friend's dad built a barn back in the '70's by burying 5 gallon pails of concrete three feet deep,with 3" heavy walled pipes anchored in the cement to support the main beams..
The building inspector was not pleased,he had wanted things buried deeper (frost line can go as deep as 4 feet here,but 2 feet is average)..but decided it was "good enough for a horse barn",and let it slide..it still stands today,and nothing "bad" has happened..

He also put an addition on the barn around 1980,he decided it was too difficult for him to use the previous method,he was now unable to do the work like once before--he used 6x6 pressure treated poles ,in holes he dug with a gas powered post hole digger ,and he just put a few inches of crushed stone at the bottom,and coated the posts with roofing tar,then put a large plastic trash bag around the post over the tar,and made sure it stuck up about a foot past the ground,then just poured cement around the posts in the hole,the quick setting stuff..nothing has ever heaved,or rotted yet..

Goes to show some unusual building methods do work!..but may not be approved by your local building inspector..
Personally I think the steel brackets on top of a sonotube full of concrete are not as strong as having a post buried directly,those galvanized brackets are not all that thick,can rust after awhile ,and let the wall tilt or lean..the bolts buried in the concrete can rot away too..yet it is the "preferred" method..


Tractor-Holic is offline  
post #11 of 16 Old 07-17-2019, 11:16 AM Thread Starter
Senior MTF Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Va.
Posts: 336
Re: New stairs problem?!?

It wasn't dug out. It was dug beside it. The supervisor just left. We were able to poke a 4ft piece of rebar underneath until we hit solid ground. He agreed it wasn't right, I'm glad I spotted it now. We'll get it fixed.

At my grandparents large old house has a concrete front porch with four large wood 20ft. columns the bottom started to rot. Years ago a contractor friend said how to fix it by putting two 2" vent plugs each one, cut off lower 2ft. Then on solid blocks larger than post with a 1/4" stainless steel plate on top. It was a real job jacking up porch roof at each post while I did it. Everything painted back white columns look fine and holding up well.

Sent from my SM-S320VL using Tapatalk
Sevenhills1952 is offline  
post #12 of 16 Old 07-17-2019, 11:35 AM
Proud Member of the 1K Club
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Northern Florida (Almost Alabama)
Posts: 1,067
Re: New stairs problem?!?

From those pictures you posted, it almost appears that the stairs are only a temporary fix to reach the different levels as a retaining wall should be there. In the last two pics, you can even see where water has eroded the side above the tooth marks of the bucket used.
Flaken is offline  
post #13 of 16 Old 07-17-2019, 01:56 PM
Senior MTF Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Michigan
Posts: 515
Re: New stairs problem?!?

The 4th and 5th pics show the post ending a few inches below the general grade level. If in Virginia the frost line is below that, it will heave. What I can't tell is whether that clump it is sitting on is concrete or dirt. IF concrete, they might have figured it will support the post, but that is not quality by any means. If is isn't concrete and it is dirt, that should be a show stopper. Have your contractor have a look at it and fix it right. You might also check a few other spots just in case. Respect is hard to get and easily lost. I'd say your contractor lost his on this deal.
Just an opinion. Good luck.

X 500 48" Deck 48" blade
Cyclone Rake
Stihl BR 600
Sears Suburban Super 12 1968
Craftsman 1990 something LG Tractor 46" deck
Original Kohler 8hp Giant Vac early 1960s
Alien5044 is offline  
post #14 of 16 Old 07-17-2019, 02:03 PM
Senior MTF Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Michigan
Posts: 515
Re: New stairs problem?!?

Second thought: With that post being in the side of a slope, you have to remember that frost freezes not only downward, but also sideways from the soil surface. Consequently, that post will need to be below the frost line as measured from a point somewhere down slope from the upper grade level. After a year, I'd predict that you will see that corner "popped up" as compared to the rest unless fixed.

X 500 48" Deck 48" blade
Cyclone Rake
Stihl BR 600
Sears Suburban Super 12 1968
Craftsman 1990 something LG Tractor 46" deck
Original Kohler 8hp Giant Vac early 1960s
Alien5044 is offline  
post #15 of 16 Old 07-17-2019, 05:28 PM Thread Starter
Senior MTF Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Va.
Posts: 336
Re: New stairs problem?!?

Thanks for replies. So glad I caught it early.
(It's raining now, finally after many weeks no rain.)
When it dries out I'll dig beside this post from inside and put another treated post beside it. Once I hit solid ground I'll go another 30" or so, some quickrete in bottom, quickrete around it, packed in well then I got 5/8" zinc threaded rod I'll bolt them together. Then I'll run 2x6s all the way up two sides and backfill.
I'll make two steps up to this walkway from there. I was here when guy put other posts in and I know they're ok.
It should last my lifetime anyway.

Sent from my SM-S320VL using Tapatalk
Sevenhills1952 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the MyTractorForum.com - The Friendliest Tractor Forum and Best Place for Tractor Information forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome