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post #1 of 16 Old 04-20-2019, 09:27 AM Thread Starter
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Help--Think I messed up with lawn?

Well I thought I would take care of crab-grass this year but now have yellow spots and grass is slow growing?

I put down Princep Liquid, at 2 QT per acre like it said and now have yellow and slow growth ares? I e-mailed place I bought it and they said not to use it in Michigan grass? But they sell it here and they have a chart for northern states about when to put it down? Don,t make sense?

The label is confusing and does say some grass may have Temporary yellow and slow growth. So what now? I sprayed this on a friends lawn too about two acres and worried I killed his lawn?? We live in country in southern Michigan and have country lawns--alot weeds and what ever in it.

Anyone else have any ideas on this? Anything I can do for the lawn now??

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post #2 of 16 Old 04-20-2019, 10:25 AM
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Re: Help--Think I messed up with lawn?

Scotts has the same warning on their label for Step 1. All you can do now is wait. Hopefully, the lawn will green up within a short time. If not, you may have to re-seed after the Princep washes through.

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post #3 of 16 Old 04-20-2019, 05:05 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Help--Think I messed up with lawn?

Quote:
Originally Posted by APinNY View Post
Scotts has the same warning on their label for Step 1. All you can do now is wait. Hopefully, the lawn will green up within a short time. If not, you may have to re-seed after the Princep washes through.
I guess thats it like you said. I read and read the directions but I sure missed something? Hers some directions I went by;
Precautions: On newly sprigged turfgrass, hybrid bermudagrass, nondormant bermudagrass or nondormant zoysiagrass, temporary slowing of growth and yellowing may occur following application.
To avoid turf injury, (1) Use only on turfgrass reasonably free of infestations of insects, nematodes,
and diseases. (2) Do not use on golf greens. (3) Do not use north of NC (except in the VA Coastal
Plains) or on soils with a pH above 7.8. (4) Do not use on muck or alkaline soils. (5) Do not apply
over the rooting area of trees or ornamentals not listed on this label. (6) Do not seed or overseed
with desirable turfgrass within 4 months before or 6 months after treatment. (7) Do not apply this
product to newly seeded grasses until they have overwintered and have a well-developed rhizome
system. (8) Do not exceed 2 qt/A of Princep Liquid within 12 months of seeding grasses. (9) Do not
exceed 2 lb ai/A (2 qt/A of Princep Liquid) per application. (10) Do not exceed 3 qt/A Princep Liquid
(3 lb ai/A) per calendar year. (11) Maximum of 2 applications per year

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post #4 of 16 Old 04-20-2019, 05:28 PM
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Re: Help--Think I messed up with lawn?

How did you come to use a product with Simazine anyway? This is the first time I have ever heard of it. Looking at the label it is used normally for agricultural applications. Normal pre emergent chemicals such as, Scotts-Pendemethilin, Barricade - Prodiamine and Dimension- Diopthor are the normal products used in turf for prevention of crab grass.

Proper use would dictate this not be done until soil temps nearing 60 degrees and this is a week or two off in central Wisconsin.

Is your spray equipment properly calibrated and delivering the product in an even fashion?

How can the grass be slow growing in Michigan, we haven't even thought about mowing yet here?

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post #5 of 16 Old 04-20-2019, 05:48 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Help--Think I messed up with lawn?

Quote:
Originally Posted by c5rulz View Post
How did you come to use a product with Simazine anyway? This is the first time I have ever heard of it. Looking at the label it is used normally for agricultural applications. Normal pre emergent chemicals such as, Scotts-Pendemethilin, Barricade - Prodiamine and Dimension- Diopthor are the normal products used in turf for prevention of crab grass.

Proper use would dictate this not be done until soil temps nearing 60 degrees and this is a week or two off in central Wisconsin.

Is your spray equipment properly calibrated and delivering the product in an even fashion?

How can the grass be slow growing in Michigan, we haven't even thought about mowing yet here?
Well I got two lawns to do, my lawn [is 2.3 acres] and a friends lawn is 2.5 acres so I got a nice sprayer and looked for something that suppose to work for crab-grass. And I went by the table on University of Michigan has about when to put it down; [ GDD Tracker 4.0 - Turf Pest Management Tracking and Alerts with Growing Degree Day Models for Michigan, Illinois, Indiana and Ohio - Project initiated by Michigan State University ] And I thought I read the label enough times but misses something? I did a dry run with filling up 30 Gal. just water and going over lawns to be sure it was the correct amount before I added chemical. And yes we are starting to mow around here now grass is growing [except some of my lawn?]
The lable is confusing to say the least. Part says [on there chart] put it down on turf grass then another place says don,t use north of NC?? Wow, why do they even sell it up here if a person not suppose to use it here? Then it says some grass might turn yellow and be slow growing for a while?? I live in country we have all kinds of grasses and weds anyways here. You can read and read the lable and one part says to do this and another says not to do this etc and etc. Goes on and on,, I messed up. Some parts of my lawn are ok?? So I think it,s just all different grasses we have here in country??

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post #6 of 16 Old 04-20-2019, 07:11 PM
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Re: Help--Think I messed up with lawn?

If it isn't for areas north of NC, then Princep shouldn't be marketing the product to dealers in those areas. Anything to make money.

Al

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post #7 of 16 Old 04-20-2019, 08:21 PM
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Re: Help--Think I messed up with lawn?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Durfman View Post
Well I got two lawns to do, my lawn [is 2.3 acres] and a friends lawn is 2.5 acres so I got a nice sprayer and looked for something that suppose to work for crab-grass. And I went by the table on University of Michigan has about when to put it down; [ GDD Tracker 4.0 - Turf Pest Management Tracking and Alerts with Growing Degree Day Models for Michigan, Illinois, Indiana and Ohio - Project initiated by Michigan State University ] And I thought I read the label enough times but misses something? I did a dry run with filling up 30 Gal. just water and going over lawns to be sure it was the correct amount before I added chemical. And yes we are starting to mow around here now grass is growing [except some of my lawn?]
The lable is confusing to say the least. Part says [on there chart] put it down on turf grass then another place says don,t use north of NC?? Wow, why do they even sell it up here if a person not suppose to use it here? Then it says some grass might turn yellow and be slow growing for a while?? I live in country we have all kinds of grasses and weds anyways here. You can read and read the lable and one part says to do this and another says not to do this etc and etc. Goes on and on,, I messed up. Some parts of my lawn are ok?? So I think it,s just all different grasses we have here in country??
Sprayers need to be calibrated. This is not only important, it is the law. (FIFRA)

Several factors effect rate of delivery:
-speed of sprayer
-amount delivered per nozzle
-nozzle spacing
-correct overlap
-pressure

This might help:


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post #8 of 16 Old 04-20-2019, 08:25 PM
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Re: Help--Think I messed up with lawn?

Quote:
Originally Posted by APinNY View Post
If it isn't for areas north of NC, then Princep shouldn't be marketing the product to dealers in those areas. Anything to make money.
Chemicals like this are sold across the nation, if you are buying bulk industrial strength chemicals such as this most users have chemical applicator's licenses and are required to know proper use of the product. Ultimately the label is the law and applying in violation of the label instruction is against the law, FIFRA.

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post #9 of 16 Old 04-20-2019, 08:35 PM
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Re: Help--Think I messed up with lawn?

Someone mentioned sprayer calibration being the law. The law also mandates that you know what you are using and doing when applying any pesticide or herbicide. Homeowners are sometimes exempt on their own property but certainly not when doing it for others. As far as dealers carrying it, it does have legitimate uses in agriculture. As far as them selling it to the OP thats not an issue if he requested it to use on his own property. They really have no duty to educate or tutor a customer. Maybe better research or education would have been in order.
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post #10 of 16 Old 04-20-2019, 08:37 PM
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Re: Help--Think I messed up with lawn?

Does that law apply to everyone or just to licensed applicators?

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post #11 of 16 Old 04-20-2019, 08:41 PM
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Re: Help--Think I messed up with lawn?

Its been a few years but we used to put down prowl or treflan to comtrol crabgrass. It stops grass germination so will not hurt the existing grass but will prevent new seeds from germinating. Dual is another that works about the same but if the temperatures get cool it will turn existing plants yellow until it warms up good. I suspect that your grass will grow out of it when the weather gets warm for a while. I always thought princep was another ttpe or brand of atrazine which is very persistent in the soil?
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post #12 of 16 Old 04-20-2019, 08:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by APinNY View Post
Does that law apply to everyone or just to licensed applicators?
It applies in different ways to everyone.
Liscensed applicators are held to higher standards as they may use products on other peoples property, but unliscensed applicators certainly have the potential to do unlawful things too, even if just on their own property. Some chemicals can pollute waterways or kill fish and wildlife. Some chemicals can drift through the air and kill neighbors plants. There’s more scenarios but Im sure you all know what I’m saying.
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post #13 of 16 Old 04-21-2019, 12:22 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Help--Think I messed up with lawn?

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Originally Posted by Junky View Post
Its been a few years but we used to put down prowl or treflan to comtrol crabgrass. It stops grass germination so will not hurt the existing grass but will prevent new seeds from germinating. Dual is another that works about the same but if the temperatures get cool it will turn existing plants yellow until it warms up good. I suspect that your grass will grow out of it when the weather gets warm for a while. I always thought princep was another ttpe or brand of atrazine which is very persistent in the soil?
We had 3 days heavy rain here and I been walking around lawn today and most is just yellow and not growing and theres even large places where I put it down and grass there is fine? Just here theres so many different things growing and different types of grasses in lawn hard to tell what a person needs. And couple places where I turn around and over lapped is bad but only few spots of that.
Couple weeks should tell but think it be ok?

I,m not making excuses I just miss-interpreted the label is all--- I think they should have in BIG letters about not using on turf in north not a small sentience?
I know I sound stupid now but did go by there chart on cool and warm states to use it and even thought they were talking about cool states being cool now and then they be warm up and ok?? Dumb huh?

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post #14 of 16 Old 04-21-2019, 12:41 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Help--Think I messed up with lawn?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Junky View Post
Its been a few years but we used to put down prowl or treflan to comtrol crabgrass. It stops grass germination so will not hurt the existing grass but will prevent new seeds from germinating. Dual is another that works about the same but if the temperatures get cool it will turn existing plants yellow until it warms up good. I suspect that your grass will grow out of it when the weather gets warm for a while. I always thought princep was another ttpe or brand of atrazine which is very persistent in the soil?
Some photos of my mess--
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post #15 of 16 Old 04-21-2019, 01:38 PM
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Re: Help--Think I messed up with lawn?

Hey Durfman, you’re not stupid at all in my opinion. Thats how people learn best is by doing. I admire people who do things rather than procrastinate.. Your Turf will probably green up and if not it may fill in by root growth. Starting from seed wouldn’t be a good option until the princep wears down. Your local (usually in county seat) USDA office could probably advise you best on your options as they differ by area. Or perhaps a good lawn care operator. Good luck!
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