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post #1 of 12 Old 05-07-2019, 05:37 PM Thread Starter
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Non ethanol fuel sources

Was at my local power shop picking up a voltage regulator and the service writer was pitching the canned vp fuel. you know The $1 an ounce stuff Saying to a homeowner that since we are in Illinois all fuel has ethanol. I felt like calling his bull crap out but held back. It is true most gas stations sell fuel with ethanol. Marinas sell fuel without ethanol. And so does your local airport. There is also a website purefuel.org that lists stations.


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post #2 of 12 Old 05-07-2019, 05:52 PM
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Re: Non ethanol fuel sources

I only use VP Fuel, Trufuel, Stihl Motomix and the like in my two stroke engines which are all Stihl. It makes all the difference in the world in them. As for the four stroke engines, I try to buy ethanol free gas, it has to be better on them over time, seals, gaskets, O-rings, etc. Ethanol fuel has ruined many an engine IMO.

It does cost more but it runs when you want it to.

As for marina and airport gas, there's an upcharge there also.

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post #3 of 12 Old 05-08-2019, 09:09 AM
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Re: Non ethanol fuel sources

Here in NY we're able to get ethanol free at a lot Stewart's convenience stores. Unfortunately for me, Orange County and other counties towards NYC are in what is known as the "Metropolitan Commuter Transportation District,Ē or MCTD for short. The MCTD includes the counties of Manhattan, Bronx, Kings (Brooklyn), Queens, Richmond (Staten Island), Rockland, Nassau, Suffolk, Orange, Putnam, Dutchess and Westchester. That includes taxes and air quality rules and we don't gain much in the way of benefits. That zone also disallows sale of non ethanol fuel. But fortunately for me I'm just six miles from Sullivan county which isn't in the zone and there is a Stewart's there that does sell it. So Every month or so I go up and pick up 10 gallons at the pump and an ice cream cone or milkshake at the counter. Plus I occasionally run down the road another couple of miles and stop by and say hi to Ericjr16 and his dad. Use it in mowers, saws, trimmers and atv's. Any leftover at month's end goes in truck.
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post #4 of 12 Old 05-08-2019, 11:04 AM
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Re: Non ethanol fuel sources

Years ago I used to go to the small airport a few miles away and sneak my '69 GTO into the hanger area and get my tank filled with aviation fuel --it was 110 octane with lead back then in the 80's..even that long ago,I recall it costing $50 to fill the 16 gallon tank!..
Car ran like a dragster with that fuel in it though..it was no slug with pump gas either..

Last time I went to that airport was probably 10 years ago--it's all fenced off now,and "off limits" to anyone who isn't an employee..I asked about buying some AV gas,and they guy said "you have a plane ?"..."No,I want it for my small engines"..he rolled his eyes and told me to "get lost" using a more vulgar common way of saying it..
I was told since 9-1-1 they don't let anyone go behind the fence without authorization..

There are no non-ethanol gas stations local to me ,in MA I think maybe only a Marina might be allowed to sell any,but it'll be $6+ a gallon and the nearest one is 30 miles away..most landscapers use VP race fuel ,that can only be had in 5 gallon cans at a few bulk oil distributors or speed shops and its about $80+ per pail..
Or you can buy the $1 an ounce Tru-Fuel" at various stores..


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post #5 of 12 Old 05-08-2019, 11:19 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Non ethanol fuel sources

I donít mean to wander into fuel taxes but why it is Red diesel is available with no road tax for farming and construction in rural areas Do they even make dyed gasoline without road tax for farming, landscaping, off road use. Iím thinking not a big demand for off road gas or to hard to police itís use. Iíve heard that you can get credit for non road use gas taxes when you file taxes.


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post #6 of 12 Old 05-08-2019, 11:46 AM
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Re: Non ethanol fuel sources

Quote:
Originally Posted by groomerz View Post
I donít mean to wander into fuel taxes but why it is Red diesel is available with no road tax for farming and construction in rural areas Do they even make dyed gasoline without road tax for farming, landscaping, off road use. Iím thinking not a big demand for off road gas or to hard to police itís use. Iíve heard that you can get credit for non road use gas taxes when you file taxes.
I get the ethanol free gas in Alabama and use it for everything from my truck to lawn care. Better gas mileage is the main reason.

groomerz: The reason diesel is dyed is almost strictly for tax purposes. Generally, red diesel is made for equipment that is used either off road or in farm use. Farmers use the diesel for the production of their crops so it is taxed lower for those purposes. Farmers and others have tax exempt certifications for that reason. The other diesel is for everyone else for their diesel stuff, usually personal vehicles. The dye used can be detected even in very tiny amounts. So if you are thinking of mixing the two, the fines are quite high if you get caught. LEO or some other government official can have your fuel tested if they want to.
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post #7 of 12 Old 05-08-2019, 12:47 PM
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Re: Non ethanol fuel sources

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Originally Posted by groomerz View Post
Was at my local power shop picking up a voltage regulator and the service writer was pitching the canned vp fuel. you know The $1 an ounce stuff Saying to a homeowner that since we are in Illinois all fuel has ethanol. I felt like calling his bull crap out but held back. It is true most gas stations sell fuel with ethanol. Marinas sell fuel without ethanol. And so does your local airport. There is also a website purefuel.org that lists stations.


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I live in Illinois and have two sources near me for ethanol free gas.

Again, the VP fuels along with other brands let your small engines run like they should when they should. Otherwise, it's a hunk of metal that you want to throw off a cliff.

Mowers that I have junked because of ethanol,
3 Lawn Boy walk behind mowers, all self propelled, 2 with magnesium decks.

Ethanol has been the death of millions of dollars worth of small engines, unknowingly, we all did it to ourselves.

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post #8 of 12 Old 05-08-2019, 01:35 PM
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Re: Non ethanol fuel sources

Quote:
Originally Posted by groomerz View Post
I donít mean to wander into fuel taxes but why it is Red diesel is available with no road tax for farming and construction in rural areas Do they even make dyed gasoline without road tax for farming, landscaping, off road use. Iím thinking not a big demand for off road gas or to hard to police itís use. Iíve heard that you can get credit for non road use gas taxes when you file taxes.


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In New York #2 diesel fuel is primarily dyed red for heating oil, hence free of motor fuel taxes. "clear" diesel is for road use and the taxes are at least as much as the cost of the produce....no difference in the product ...just in the color. An inspector from New York State Department of Taxation and Finance arrives unannounced, several times a year, at my garage and samples the diesel fuel tanks on the vehicles...any red diesel fuel in a vehicle tank is a really big problem.
As far as gasoline is concerned, New York is in EPA region 2 and you simply cannot get ethanol free gasoline (Trufuel is not gasoline) ...even at Marinas in 11 of the 26 Counties in New York...this link will show you in which counties in each state one cannot get ethanol free gasoline
https://www.epa.gov/gasoline-standar...lated-gasoline

Last edited by MARK (LI); 05-08-2019 at 01:40 PM.
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post #9 of 12 Old 05-09-2019, 11:00 AM
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Re: Non ethanol fuel sources

I'm baffled by the diesel fuel vs heating oil price differences and taxation "dyes"..

My home heating oil tank is filled by a local oil company,and it has the same green looking fuel in it as I get from the diesel pump at a filling station...yet it is at least 50 cents a gallon cheaper than pump diesel is,due to it not being "on road" taxable fuel..but its the same fuel,even the delivery driver said so--he gets his bulk fuel from the same depot near Boston,that all the diesel fuel tankers fill up at..

I have a few friends with oil heat and I look in their oil tank and see red dyed fuel,looks like cranberry juice..one owns a mobile home,and his furnace uses kerosene,which was also dyed red in his tank..I thought kerosene was clear or yellowish ?...

This leads me to believe that not all fuel gets dyed "properly" ,or we are just getting boned an extra 50+ cents a gallon just because its being burned in an engine in a registered vehicle on roads..


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post #10 of 12 Old 05-15-2019, 10:38 AM
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Re: Non ethanol fuel sources

Here it is again boys:

https://www.pure-gas.org

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post #11 of 12 Old 05-15-2019, 11:17 AM
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Re: Non ethanol fuel sources

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Originally Posted by CCMoe View Post
I only use VP Fuel, Trufuel, Stihl Motomix and the like in my two stroke engines which are all Stihl. It makes all the difference in the world in them. As for the four stroke engines, I try to buy ethanol free gas, it has to be better on them over time, seals, gaskets, O-rings, etc. Ethanol fuel has ruined many an engine IMO.

It does cost more but it runs when you want it to.

As for marina and airport gas, there's an upcharge there also.

CCMoe
Yes, you are correct that there is an upcharge for e-free boat gas and aviation gas. But it's still waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay cheaper than buying quarts of premixed 2 stroke fuel from Tru Fuel, VP, Stihl and the like. And besides, how many gallons of premix do you go through during the course of the cutting season? I really enjoy not having to winterize my OPE. Just put it away for the winter, and start it up a couple of times during the cold months just to run it. Two stroke engines are happy when they run.

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post #12 of 12 Old 05-15-2019, 06:27 PM
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Re: Non ethanol fuel sources

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Yes, you are correct that there is an upcharge for e-free boat gas and aviation gas. But it's still waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay cheaper than buying quarts of premixed 2 stroke fuel from Tru Fuel, VP, Stihl and the like. And besides, how many gallons of premix do you go through during the course of the cutting season? I really enjoy not having to winterize my OPE. Just put it away for the winter, and start it up a couple of times during the cold months just to run it. Two stroke engines are happy when they run.
hotajax,

I guess it is the aggravation vs. convenience, aggravation when they don't run and the convenience of premix being readily available, purchase and pour and knowing that it will run this time and the next time.

I might use two to three gallons, five tops of premix a year, chainsaws, weed trimmer, leaf blower.

Aviation fuel, I would 100% trust, marine fuel, iffy, Mississippi River is an hour west of me so readily available.

A lot of the trailered boaters fill up on pump gas before they hit the river to avoid marina fuel prices.

I will keep aviation fuel in mind if I find a need for more fuel for the two strokes.

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