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Old 03-22-2012, 08:46 AM   post #1 of 39
stevewatr
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Default utility 300 engine stuck??

Bought a IH utility 300 on the cheap, Owner parked it after the power steering failed a second time. He said it was running last spring. Left outside all winter, but we had a very mild, almost snow free winter, the engine was covered with a tarp, no vertical exhaust for water to get into, but when I tried to crank the starter, it appears locked up tight, fan blade barely wigggles about 1/8". Pulled all spark plugs, only one had signs of slight rust. Squirted Marvel mystery oil in all cylinders, let sit, tried again over couple days, no luck. Put a large pipe wrench on a shaft that comes out the front to drive the loaders remote hydraulic pump, put a cheater pipe on that, applied lots of force, still locked. Filled up all cylinders with clean diesel fuel, tried starter every day over the next week, no luck. Noticed diesel fuel now dripping from under rear area where engine bolts up to clutch area. Yesterday manually raise the loaded, aired up the tires, and tried towing it. I moves okay in neutral, also moves okay in gear with clutch depressed, so we tried rolling it, then popping clutch.....no luck. I was going to pull the head, but wanted to run this by more experienced people first. It just seems strange to me that sitting for one year would have seized things up this bad. Can anybody think of somthing else that might lock it up?? Rolls with clutch in, so I assume that rules out tranny. I do not think it has a TA, because there is no vertical lever to engage it. It does have a linkage that appears to be disconnected, or missing parts located just rear of where the clutch pedal linkage attaches. Any thoughts would be appreciated.
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Old 03-22-2012, 01:08 PM   post #2 of 39
DC Snider
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Default Re: utility 300 engine stuck??

it's entirely possible it is stuck. May have sit longer than you think. Pull the head and drop the oil pan and get a clsoer look before you make things alot worse!
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Old 03-22-2012, 02:37 PM   post #3 of 39
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Default Re: utility 300 engine stuck??

Drop the sump and check if the block did not maybe crack and that all the sleeves are intact... Did you drain the coolant while it was standing?
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Old 03-22-2012, 07:27 PM   post #4 of 39
stevewatr
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Default Re: utility 300 engine stuck??

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Originally Posted by Francois View Post
Drop the sump and check if the block did not maybe crack and that all the sleeves are intact... Did you drain the coolant while it was standing?
Good news is when I was contemplating how much to pay for it, I checjed the coolant level, and it looked good (decent color, good level). Oil on the dipstick showed no obvious signs of water contamination.

So both you guys think I should drop the pan, as opposed to pulling the head??

And thank you both for the replies. I may have video of the beast up on you tube soon.

Steve W.
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Old 03-22-2012, 08:32 PM   post #5 of 39
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Default Re: utility 300 engine stuck??

I saw something in the letters section of the last Antique Power magazine about "stuck" engines. They mentioned that if the engine seemed to be stuck, try turning it in the opposite direction. If there was a stuck valve and someone turned it, it might be stopped against the stuck valve and not turn any farther without damaging something. It might move in the opposite direction. If it won't turn through two full turns, the stuck valve is confirmed. Don't know if that's a possibility with your engine, but just wanted to mention it.
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Old 03-23-2012, 06:26 AM   post #6 of 39
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Default Re: utility 300 engine stuck??

I would remove the tappet cover and check if all the valves, and rockers are free, as the previous poster said could be the problem, than to remove the head as it's not lightly that there is a problem in the combustion cambers, unless water was sitting in them for a extended period of time!
If the problem is not with the valves then you can remove the sump.
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Old 03-23-2012, 07:38 AM   post #7 of 39
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Default Re: utility 300 engine stuck??

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Originally Posted by Francois View Post
I would remove the tappet cover and check if all the valves, and rockers are free, as the previous poster said could be the problem, than to remove the head as it's not lightly that there is a problem in the combustion cambers, unless water was sitting in them for a extended period of time!
If the problem is not with the valves then you can remove the sump.
Well i sure hope it is not a stuck valve, because if it is, I probably bent somthing trying to pop start her. But if I had bent somthing, I'd probably have gained a little more movement out of the crank, and I still only have about 2 degrees rotation. Time to pull the head I think.

I will try to get some video of the tractor uploaded soon, and I'll post a link.

Thanks for all the replies, I'm sure I'll be back with more questions.
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Old 03-23-2012, 02:45 PM   post #8 of 39
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Default Re: utility 300 engine stuck??

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Originally Posted by Loremaster72 View Post
I saw something in the letters section of the last Antique Power magazine about "stuck" engines. They mentioned that if the engine seemed to be stuck, try turning it in the opposite direction.........
A guy named Jim over on SSB suggested i try this before pulling the head, or droppping the pan. This morning I pulled the starter, and stuck a crow bar in the opening, and pryed up on the ring gear, and got ti to turn. It felt like it was stuck, but it did not seem too bad. I then noticed it was moving the rear wheel, as I moved the ring gear, even though it appeared to be in neutral. I depressed the clutch, and was able to rotate the motor easily with the pry bar a quarter turn, then the tranny appeared to drop out of gear. So I thougt I was in the clear, but then with the starter reinstalled, it turned about 20 degrees and stopped dead. My battery may have been low, so I through it on a fast charge, and am heading back out there now. I am going to remove the starter, and use the pry bar to see if I can rotate the motor a full revolution to make sure it not somthing in the valve train, then I'll try remounting the starter and giving it a fresh battery to suck on!
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Old 03-23-2012, 10:51 PM   post #9 of 39
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Default Re: utility 300 engine stuck??

I removed the starter, and used a pry bar on the ring gear. With a little force, i was able to start it turning, then it got easier. Rotated a quarter turn that way! Got excited and remounted the starter, but it only spun slightly,maybe 15 degrees, then seemed stuck again. Pulled the starter again, and found i could not budge it any further. Pulled the valve cover and found 3 exhaust valves stuck open. Squirted some MMO on them, and gave them a few taps. One popped free, but the other two are stuck good, I can tap them down further, but they just stay that way, so I started pulling the head. Should have it off by tommorow afternoon.
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Old 03-24-2012, 04:03 PM   post #10 of 39
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Default Re: utility 300 engine stuck??

i put a socket on an extension on the crankshaft nut through the hand crank hole on the front (after removing spark plugs and spraying penetrating oil in each hole.) i rock the engine back and forth until it goes all the way around. i just unstuck a 240 yesterday that had sat stuck for 5 years. it came loose in less that 5 min. i own a 350 utility and they are very similar. the big difference is if it sat and stuck (not bad) or was running and locked up (BAD).
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Old 03-25-2012, 10:08 AM   post #11 of 39
stevewatr
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Default Re: utility 300 engine stuck??

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i put a socket on an extension on the crankshaft nut through the hand crank hole on the front (after removing spark plugs and spraying penetrating oil in each hole.)
Drive shaft for a front mounted hydraulic pump is in the way, I ended up removing the starter, and using a crowbar to nudge the flywheel. This broke the cylinders free, but stopped dead again after less than a quarter turn of the crank. Removed the valve cover, and found three exhaust valves stuck open. Pulled the head, and with head off, and starter reinstalled, she spins fine. I'll be serviceing the head next.

I'm posting videos of this online, here is the link, you can click subscribe, and elect to be emailed as I post more videos:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M-t8UgRqvXc
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Old 03-25-2012, 10:49 AM   post #12 of 39
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Default Re: utility 300 engine stuck??

the 240 i did had 5 stuck valves. i spray top side of the valves with penetrating oil remove the rocker arms and smack them with a dead blow hammer. usualy only takes a few hits and they spring back up. after they are loose i keep smackin them a little while to make sure they arent gonna stick again. i also had 2 bent push rods. i straightened them and put them back in. it has ran good for 2 days now. yesterday i took it back to the owner and he ran it hard for a while with no issues. i was just trying to keep the cost down for him. if it were mine id replace those push rods. sounds like you are making progress
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Old 03-25-2012, 11:01 AM   post #13 of 39
stevewatr
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Default Re: utility 300 engine stuck??

Quote:
Originally Posted by elalr View Post
the 240 i did had 5 stuck valves. i spray top side of the valves with penetrating oil remove the rocker arms and smack them with a dead blow hammer. usualy only takes a few hits and they spring back up. after they are loose i keep smackin them a little while to make sure they arent gonna stick again. i also had 2 bent push rods. i straightened them and put them back in. it has ran good for 2 days now. yesterday i took it back to the owner and he ran it hard for a while with no issues. i was just trying to keep the cost down for him. if it were mine id replace those push rods. sounds like you are making progress
I tried the penetrant, and tapping down the valve stems. One freed up, but the other 2 refused to pop back up. After I pulled the head, I found the rust on the valves stems is really bad. I may need some new vakves, and guides. I'll be working on removing all valves this week, then I'll have it cleaned in a jet wash by my ;favorite automotive machinne shop. But things are looking up!

Steve.
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Old 03-31-2012, 06:40 PM   post #14 of 39
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Default Re: utility 300 engine stuck??

Well the head is off at the machine shop, awaiting it's turn in the jet cleaner, and bake oven. I oredered new intake valves, all new springs, and new guides. Decided to pull the pistons to better inspect them, and ran into a few snags.

First, I have been assuming thus tractor is a 300 utility, and thought it had a C169 motor. turns out it is a C175 motor. It is stamped right onto the block. So then I questioned if it might not be a 350 utility, then I found info that suggests they may have used C175 in the 300 near the end of the run. I had already ordered the valves, guides, and springs before realixing my error. ops:Was mad at first, but then found the C169 and 175 share the same head

Problem now is to figure out exactly what piston/cylinder this motor uses. I found on the IH site they list only one number for the C175, but when crossing to a Clevite/Mahle number, they list 2 differant ones based on serial #.

The tops of the pistons I have are the "firecrater" style, but I think the differance might be in the wrist pin diameter.

Went to pull the oil pan, and get this, it won't clear the large support arm that comes from the front axle towards the rear.:censored:

Do I actually have to remove the front axle assembly to get the oil pan off

Here is another weird thing. What I can see for serial numbers does not coincide with what the online parts manual says I should be seeing.

The manual states all 300u engine serial numbers start with 9501 with a c169 prefix, and 350u engine numbers start with a 501, and a c175 prefix. My engine serial number appears to be 3615?2, the ? looks like either a 5 or a 6. This number is stamped into the block in a flat area just above where it is embossed C-175. Also below where the firing order is embossed, there are numbers seperated by little screw heads *3*17*0*.

The tractor serial # on a tag on the clutch housing is also not making much sense to me.
The parts manual says the chassis serial numbers for both the 300 and 350 should start with 501, but mine appears to be 18267, then a long space followed by a letter R. The suffix codes in the manual say the R would designate a tractor with Torque amplifier attachment, and if mine has a TA, great, but why is it missing the lever?

I'll post part 5 of the video soon.
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Old 04-01-2012, 12:34 AM   post #15 of 39
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Default Re: utility 300 engine stuck??

Part 5:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ujnN...ature=youtu.be
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