Engine runs a few minutes and dies

[Gunslingers]

I have an Ingersol 4020 tractor that is driving me nuts! The engine will start and run normally for about 3 to 5 minutes and then die like the ignition was turned off. Sometimes in backfires right after it stops. If I wait about 15 seconds I can start it back up and it will run another few minutes and die again. I replaced the ignition coil, condenser, spark plug wires, and spark plugs but it didn't help. I pulled the top of the carburetor off to check the floats and every looked good. The engine seems like it runs out of gas and shuts down but the backfiring has me puzzled. There is about 740 hours on the engine. Any suggestions?

[Ken in NJ]

George

Dirty Fuel filter ??

Clogged air vent on fuel tank ??

I'm sure you will get some more ideas what to look for

[Gunslingers]

Ken,

Fuel filter is relatively new. Is the fuel tank air vent in the cap? In the winter the engine would run longer before shutting down. That is why I thought it may have been something electrical like a bad coil. Maybe a weak fuel pump? I am not that mechanically inclined which is why I am going after the easy things first

[WNYTractorTinkerer]

Well there- Your local parts supplier will love you for your support, huh? If it soulds like the ignition is shut off, maybe it is.. Does it start right back up? If so you may have a bad ignition connection or even a bad key switch or other Safety switch issue.. If it won't start, get a test light and start @ the key switch and test/c hase the "I" wire where-ever it goes to verify 12V when the key is on to verify continuity.. Chase it down and you will find the culprit..

[ClassicMotion]

After it dies, have you taken the carb off right away? If so, is there fuel in the bowl of the carb?

Fuel filter location and type can hinder a pump's ability to move fuel. Also, the tank screen may be clogged or corroded. Basically it creates a vacuum inside the fuel line and starves the engine similarly to plugging up the gascap breather hole. A few years back I pulled my hair out with a 220 that acted close to what you describe. After regapping the points, trying a new coil, and dismantling the carb, it ended up being the screen inside the gas tank. I snapped it off, installed a filter directly below the tank, and all was well.

[WNYTractorTinkerer]

Well there- Your local parts supplier will love you for your support, huh? If it soulds like the ignition is shut off, maybe it is.. Does it start right back up? If so you may have a bad ignition connection or even a bad key switch or other Safety switch issue.. If it won't start, get a test light and start @ the key switch and test/c hase the "I" wire where-ever it goes to verify 12V when the key is on to verify continuity.. Chase it down and you will find the culprit..

BTW---

[ClassicMotion]

The tank breather is the pinhole in the top of your gascap. As fuel exits, air moves in. It doesn't take much tank vacuum to choke a tractor.

BTW, Welcome to the forum.

[Gunslingers]

Wow, I am getting more useful information from you guys in the past few minutes than my local Ingersol dealer has given me in the past couple of weeks. Tomorrow I will check the venting of the fuel tank and the tank screen. I thought about pulling the top of the carb off as soon as the engine dies but haven't done that yet. Would fuel starvation cause the backfiring??

[Kcunningham]

When it goes to quit on ya, give it some choke and see if it wants to keep running a bit longer. If it does then its fuel and not electrical. The best way to check the tank is to unhook the fuel line up by the engine and see how the gas pours out, if it comes out in a stead stream and doesnt falter, then look at the filter or trash in the carb. While you have the fuel line loose, you may want to go ahead and drain the tank to check for things floating around in there. I doubt if its the fuel pump since it will start back up and run. Fuel filters are cheap, just put a new one on there to rule it out.

You can rule out the gas cap just by taking it off and seeing if it still does it. If you cap is like the one on mine, its kinda hard to tell if its clogged.

[ClassicMotion]

Originally Posted by Gunslingers

Wow, I am getting more useful information from you guys in the past few minutes than my local Ingersol dealer has given me in the past couple of weeks.

Fanatical Case Ingersoll acolytes tend to be like that, lol.

[Gunslingers]

I have owned Case/Ingersol tractors for the last 30 years. I can definitely understand the passion folks have for these machines and I want to keep mine running for many more years. I will try the suggestions given tomorrow and hopefully it is something simple dealing with the fuel delivery. If that is all it is then I won't even feel bad about spending the $135.00 for parts that I didn't even need

I will report back tomorrow on my findings!

[jayvee43]

Hi George, and welcome to MTF

here is another posibility I would like you to try tomorow as well, using a jumper wire with a aligator type of connector at either end, connect one end directly on the POSITIVE terminal of the IGNITION COIL and the other end directly to the BATTERY POSITIVE TERMINAL.

What that will tell us is if there is a problem in the 12 volt ignition switch or wires to the ignition coil. (They too can warm up and loose continuity and cool off and regain contact with each other)

Try running your motor for longer than a few minutes with the jumper in place BEFORE you atempt to corect anything else. I know it makes a big difference with the 12 volts directly at the coil...

Good luck

JayVee

[bhildret]

All good suggestions to pursue. Due to the popping off the muffler when it shuts down, I tend to prioritize the 12V to the coil.

JV has recommended a good approach to this.

It it very common for the ignition swtiches in these tractors to give up the ghost at this sort of age and hours, but could easily be wiring related also. Consider the engine ignition parts to be good preventive maintenance ...

Good luck and please report back ...

Brian

[Gunslingers]

OK, I attached a wire from the + battery post to the + side of the ignition coil and started the tractor. Tractor still died after running about 4 minutes.

Removed the gas cap from the tank and started the tractor. Tractor again died after running a few minutes.

Checked the screen at the bottom of the tank. Looked clean and when I detached the fuel line from the fuel pump the gas was pouring out so the screen isn't plugged.

Tried choking the engine as it was dying but that didn't have any affect either.

Had a little bit of white smoke come out of the muffler when I tried to restart the engine. After the engine died and I turned off the ignition there was a mild backfire which seemed to come from the carburetor. Can fuel delivery issues cause backfiring? I always associated backfiring with timing issues but the engine runs smooth and strong for the few minutes that it does run.

[Kcunningham]

Rich fuel mixture causes backfiring thru the carb.