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Old 10-24-2009, 11:13 AM   post #1 of 11
James F Crum
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Default Honda 4514 Tractors - Parts fading! I need a

The Unit Fuel Control module on my 1990 Honda 4514 Tractor gave out on me. It initially started out as a sputter that became a stall out problem and so I cleaned out the fuel tank and lines. Eventually I replaced the fuel pump since it was borderline on the pressure test. Then since the carburetor replacement parts cost just shy of a new carburetor I got a new one. Still not working. I gambled and replaced the rectifier unit. Nope! I finally tested all the electrical components to learn it was Unit Fuel Controller module. I called the official Honda parts store. No longer available. Then for about a year off and on now I have searched the internet for a used Unit Fuel Control Part Number 34700-758-003. I learned from hours of searching it is definitely not available new anywhere on planet earth and so I have been cruising e-bay, amazon and everywhere else looking for a used one. I have even seen a few 4514 tractor mowers sell for as low as $200 to $300 figuring the parts from one would be worth a few hundred! But they were all out of state local pickup only/ no shipping. Eventually with nothing to loose I took the outer protective casing off my failed unit fuel controller believing I might be able to test and fix somehow, since all it seemed to do was open and close the solenoid every 9 seconds to maintain the fuel flow. However by the time I got it out of the protective casing I had pretty much destroyed it and it had far more components than expected. Probably the safety features that where incorporated into the over all system. I now know the Rectifiers and Unit Fuel Controllers can't be bought new. Used I still have had not been able to find one. I have to at the reality that Honda made such good machines that they out lasted the parts supplies for them. Mine is still in great shape and just needs this one part.
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Old 10-24-2009, 11:14 AM   post #2 of 11
larryccf
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Default Re: Honda 4514 Tractors - Parts fading! I need a

just curious, why not just replace your carb with a 3813 carb? and do away with the need for the fuel controller unit altogether?
that's one of the reasons i like the 3813, less electrical/computer controlled items to fail and have to diagnose

there's one up on egay that just hit this morning
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Old 10-24-2009, 11:24 AM   post #3 of 11
James F Crum
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Default Re: Honda 4514 Tractors - Parts fading! I need a

I was unaware that the 3813 carburetors are interchangeable and can be used on a 4514 engine? It has a mechanical flow control built into it that can handle the fuel pump pressure? I did see the 3813 carburetor on e-bay. However I would imagine that eliminating the unit fuel controller you also eliminate the safety features of the mower in doing so. I also got that some have just filed the solenoid pin down slightly to allow the fuel to by pass the failing of the opening & closing function of the solenoid unit due to the failed controller. I am consider trying that.
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Old 10-24-2009, 11:39 AM   post #4 of 11
larryccf
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Default Re: Honda 4514 Tractors - Parts fading! I need a

the 4514 is basically a 3813 engine, with larger muffler, and i suspect a higher profile cam - carb may be jetted little richer - but the 3813 fuel pump and 4514 pump i suspect (strongly) are the same pump

i put a used 4518 pump on my 3813 and it's been running fine

as far as the safety issue, an awful lot of lawn tractors that are out there without that solenoid, must be safety hazards - sorry, being smart and i shouldn't be, but suspect you get the point -
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Old 10-24-2009, 05:35 PM   post #5 of 11
Dave4514
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Default Re: Honda 4514 Tractors - Parts fading! I need a

The Fuel Control Unit is used to stop the engine by blocking fuel flow. The only reason for the timer is Honda decided that 9 seconds is the time needed to insure the engine stops when the fuel cut solenoid is activated. Powering the fuel cut solenoid for longer than 9 seconds runs the risk of overheating it.

The fix to replace the NLA fuel control might be a simple normally open push button that is wired to the between the fuel cut solenoid and +12 volts. To stop the engine turn off the ignition switch and press the push button to send power to the solenoid. The brown wire from the Cs terminal on the control unit is the one to use for the push button.

If your fuel control unit is destroyed a more extensive fix will be required. The wiring diagram shows connections to the fuel pump and even the headlights from this control unit. If you can plug in your old unit and see if the headlights still work, it will give me something to work with for I repair idea.
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Old 10-24-2009, 06:59 PM   post #6 of 11
markusedma
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Default Re: Honda 4514 Tractors - Parts fading! I need a

I'm a little confused... do you not need power applied to the solenoid for the carb to let fuel into the main jet? Just looking at it now and if the solenoid is not powered then the fuel is cut... I checked while running and there was constant power to it, when I shut it off it maintains power for a few seconds after and then drops to 0.. So what is this thing really doing??
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Old 10-24-2009, 07:25 PM   post #7 of 11
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Default Re: Honda 4514 Tractors - Parts fading! I need a

Sorry for the confusion. There are two versions of the 4514s. Frame serial numbers 1000001 to 1006846 used the Fuel Control Unit and it powered the fuel cut solenoid to stop fuel flow. Frame numbers 1006847 and up did not use the Fuel Control Unit but still had the fuel cut solenoid but it worked by cutting off the fuel when not powered. I'll bet yours is like mine and does not have the control unit.
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Old 10-26-2009, 01:04 AM   post #8 of 11
kahuna33811
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Default Re: Honda 4514 Tractors - Parts fading! I need a

Had the same problem with my 4514. The control unit you are talking about also powers the fuel pump. The carb solenoid needs power to to let fuel flow.What I did was wire the brown wire to the solenoid ,to the fuel pump wire (yellow). Mine has run fine since and the safetys still work as well. I think you could wire around the control unit if yours is toast and get every thing working again.
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Old 10-26-2009, 11:43 AM   post #9 of 11
Dave4514
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Default Re: Honda 4514 Tractors - Parts fading! I need a

I guess I'm wrong about how the fuel cut solenoid works with the fuel control module. Powering the solenoid must allow fuel flow. It seems strange that Honda built in a 9 second timer to power the solenoid. Later models of the 4514 did not have this timer and kept power to the solenoid to keep fuel flowing. Live and learn!
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Old 11-04-2009, 09:15 AM   post #10 of 11
James F Crum
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Default Re: Honda 4514 Tractors - Parts fading! I need a

Thanx for the responses. First I learned only the first year 4514 models had the 9 second delay timer in the fuel control module to protect the solenoid from over heating and burn out. The later models didn't so I ordered the later version carburetor that didn't have that safety feature requirement to protect the solenoid on the carburetor. I decided to try wiring directly around the problem and so haveing the shop manuel I followed the wiring diagram and just wired everything directly as though the fuel control module was plugged in with the exception that I found the Blue wire/12 volt power remained active even when the ignition/start switch was off. So I just wired a toggle switch between the power and outgoing yellow wire/fuel pump and brown wire/carburetor solenoid. I grounded the remaining 2 black wires according to the wiring diagram. It started right up and ran fine! I'm holding off on installing the new carburetor to see how long the solenoid lasts on the old one before it burns out. I'm not sure why the blue wire remained hot even with the starter/ignition switch off. My guess is the unit fuel control module might have handled that some how. My toggle switch has a led light in it to remind me to turn it off and thus turning off the fuel pump and carburetor solenoid. All the safety features still work fine. Thanx for all the feed back.
Now I need the bushings (Bushing Tensioner Arm Part Num: 76121-750-000)for the belt tension pully arm to the deck! The ones in it now are worn out and the flappy vibration from the gaps have made operating risky at best. I had order some before but got sent the wrong ones. Strange since my parts look up for them showed the parts universal for all the model years. Reorder new ones from different supplier and waiting for them to arrive! While waiting I have been trying to find and create an alternate bushing sleeve. 3/4" Grey PVC has the same wall dimension and so I'm cutiing a section out to reduce the over-all dimension and then heating it to bend it into the size I need to make it fit. The original bushings had a lip on them between the metal arm and holding bolts. Have to give that some thought.

Last edited by James F Crum; 11-04-2009 at 09:31 AM.
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Old 11-04-2009, 11:22 AM   post #11 of 11
larryccf
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Default Re: Honda 4514 Tractors - Parts fading! I need a

go to mcmaster.com
do a search for bronze flanged bushings - suspect you'll find your bushings are stock off the shelf items

if you have a caliper, mike the one you have on it or the shaft OD it rides on, and the opening ID
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