MF1855 control valve hook-up for P/S control

[butchs_hobby]

I've put the P/S cylinder and control valve from a 400JD on my 1855MF, got it all mounted and hydralic lines run. I t'd into the pressure and return lines from the hydro pump that go to the control valves for the mid&rear lift and connected to the in&out ports on the steering control valve. It don't work right. Some how it's killed the pressure, lifts&steering barely work. Anyone know how I should have hooked up these hoses?

[tractormike]

What happens if you use the steering and the lift valve at the same time? I'm no expert but by the way I think you have plumbed the hydraulics if you have a open center valve when you try the steering the hydraulic oil may be following the path of least resistance and going through the lift valve and not building any pressure to steer. When you use the lift valve the oil may be going through the steering valve and just returning through the return line. Try holding the lift valve in the up position and see if you have any steering. Just my 2 cents worth.

[butchs_hobby]

I thought about that last night, I'm going to try it sometime today. In the shop manuel for the tractor it says to hold the implement lever up and hold it to check the lift pressure. That makes me think the lift controls are open center valves. I'm thinking I should have ran the pressure line to the P/S control valve and then back to the lift valves. I tried capping the pressure line and the lifts worked right, ran a line from the P/S valve out port into a drain pan, it's an open center valve--ran a good stream of fluid till I'd move the steering wheel. I'm determined to make this P/S work, not haveing P/S is the only complaint I've ever had with this little tractor. With the FEL full of sand or dirt I could hardly turn it.

[butchs_hobby]

Tractormike, thanks for responding, believe I've got her figured out but couldn't find the hydralic fittings I needed today. The place I usually go is closed till Monday so I'll have to wait till then. You were right, the valves are open type and installing the T's was wrong, just gave the oil another way to go instead of making pressure.
Different tractor---I've got an MF12 hydro thats in a million pieces right now, I'd like to put the two speed rearend and hydro from a MF16 under it. I've already got the complete assembly, any ideas of what all I'll run into doing this?

[tractormike]

I've never had a 14 or 16 massey to play with so I am not going to be much help to you on putting that tranny into the massey 12. What I do know is that it is much more fun to make something like that work:fing32: . Is the massey 14 tranny shaft driven by the engine? You might need a 90 degree gearbox to do it but I say go for it!!! With a torch and a welder a lot of things are possible:fing32: :fing32: :fing32:
Keep us posted!

[oldron]

I am with Mike. Go for it ,altering is a good thing.They call my son None Stock Nick and he came by it honestly.:goodl:

[butchs_hobby]

I'm darn sure going to give that rearend swap a try. I'm trying to decide what motor to use in it. I've got the 12hp motor, but it needs rebuilt. The 16hp Kohler K in my 1650 runs like a new one, might use it and put an 18hp V-twin Vanguard in the 1650 or rebuild the B-48 Onan thats in my 1855mf, put a 23hp Vanguard in it and the Onan in the 12hp tractor. Or put a 16-18hp Vanguard in the 12 tractor. When I talked to Jim (jimsrepairjimstractors.com) he really recommends the Vanguards and probably the reason I'll put one in this 12 tractor is he said they sound like a baby Harley idleing. I'm thinking dual chrome stacks?

[butchs_hobby]

Got the P/S on and hooked up correctly, talk about night and day difference! Think I'm really gonna like this!

[Beertestr]

Butch:

I'd love to see this setup, I want to power steer my tractor as well. I am planning a FEL build for it possibly this winter, so driving the hydraulics might be done with the added pump I'll run for the FEL. I'd love to see the servo ram setup you did. Got any more servo valves laying around? Any idea what else I can use for a control valve. I live near Metro Detroit, there are not a lot of tractor graveyard to pilfer parts from.

Any help is appreciated.

[butchs_hobby]

Beertestr, e-mail me, I'll send what ever pics or shop manuel/parts book copies that will help you. About three years ago I built a back-hoe for my 1855, uses the same pump as the FEL. I've only used the tractor 1.5-2hrs since getting the P/S on and I see one hose that needs rerouted, but thats easy. The early MF garden tractors are tough machines and the 1655/1855 was the biggest and best IMO. My FEL is a Johnson workhorse 48" bucket, it was on the tractor when I bought it plus a 48" tiller , 42" brush hog, and 54"mmm. I've got the book that came with the FEL new, has good pics and a parts break down, if that'll help you let me know. I've got a 445JD too but my ole 1855 is the tractor I go get when I need to do dirt work, moving trailers,andetc.

[olcowhand]

Butch, the steering valve you used only has 4 ports? If so, you want to pick up your pressure for steering AFTER the lift valves. If you pick up steering pressure before the lift valves, when using the lift & you top or bottom the lift circuit, you will be backloading the steering valve with locked full pressure which can blow the seals. The steering valve seals aren't designed to handle those pressures. A 5 port steering valve has a built-in priority valve which sends the 5th port to power the lift circuits, etc, preventing the backpressure.
Beertestr, I have a MF1650 I modified & built a FEL for it also. I use the elec pto clutch to run the hydraulic pump for the loader. I run my steering off the hydro so I can turn the hydraulic pump off when not using FEL.

[butchs_hobby]

Olcowhand, after thinking on this farther I did hook the P/S in after the lift valves. It had occurred to me that what you described would happen. I now wish I'd have went with a hydralic steering instead of the power assisted steering. It does work but because of the way the steering rod is bent(sector to pivot) it side loads the valve and makes a little hard spot before the valve moves and the power assist kicks in. It would have been easier to run the hoses on the hydralic steering too. Think I'll go to that style before I do my redo of the whole tractor. I did use it for about an hour with the FEL on and it worked great(except for that little hard spot), I had the bucket full sitting still and could easily turn the steering where before I could have barely moved it two-handed.
I've still got my 1650's front end torn down, haven't got the axle and steering sector housing back from the machine shop yet. This tractors main use is mowing and the spindles/ bushings were worn so i elected to put roller bearings in all the pivot points including the sector. I'm hoping this will take most of the play out of the steering and make it easier to steer too.

[butchs_hobby]

I've now came up with a 5 port steering valve so that I can make it hydralic steering instead of power assisted. If I'm thinking correctly I can run the hydro pump pressure line to the steering valve first then on to the lift valves or would I be better blocking the power beyond port and leave it hooked up as I now have it(pressure to lift valves and the lift valve return to the steering assist).
I am soo glad I've had the power assist on the tractor for all the F.E.L. work I've done this past week (IKE clean-up). The control valve leaks a little but it'll be replaced when I convert to hydralic steering but otherwise worked great for about 20hrs on the tractor this week. After all the work that ole 1855 has done without complaint this past week, I think I'll keep her, some new paint, overhaul the motor and hydro, probably last longer than me!