Prony Brake at Makoti, ND

[jechrist2]

We took the Blue Brake to Makoti, ND the weekend of October 7 & 8 for the last steam show for the year. They have a nice line up of steam engines

http://www.98dodge.com/jerry/makotia1.jpg

A couple of the engines on the right side of the picture didn't run for the show. The first 5 or 6 were pretty active.

The fourth engine from the left, a Nicholls and Sheppard two cylinder, was the first steam engine in the brake. This engine probably was rated around 150psi. He is only rated at 85psi now. We didn't measure hp on this engine, but we did get to listen to it run.

http://www.98dodge.com/jerry/makotia2.jpg



I don't know who the person with the wide brimmed hat is that is sitting on the tractor tire on the left. One of my cohorts, Jim T., is standing on the other side of the brake wearing the blue shirt and cap. The fellow in the camafloge jacket he is talking to is Jerome S from Makoti.

Jerome brought his Minneapolis Steam Engine over belted up to the brake.

http://www.98dodge.com/jerry/makotia3.jpg

This engine was also rated in the 150psi range when is was new. Now it is rated for 90psi. He has 25 - 75 hp painted on the water tender of his tank. Judging the size of the boiler, the 25 could be the boiler horsepower. When this engine was sold it was rated by boiler horsepower only. The Case company was the first to rate their engines by pulley or belt horsepower.

Even though his engine has a low pressure rating, he put on a good show. The engine has a nice "bark" when it is working. The Minneapolis did put out 49hp in the belt. Jerome was quite pleased with that number.

This is another shot of Jim T. operating the brake with Jerome's Minneapolis in the belt. I was happy to see everyone in the picture looking the correct direction for once!

http://www.98dodge.com/jerry/makotia4.jpg

We had some smaller gas tractors come over. One fellow belted his IH and then came to the side and hooked up the PTO to see if we could measure any difference in hp. Some people claim that a tractor like an IH will do better on the PTO than on the belt because there is a bevel gear set on the belt pulley that robs some power. Simillarly some claim that John Deeres will do better on the belt than PTO because the PTO runs through a bevel gear.

I gave the owner of the tractor the worksheet we had, I don't remember what size of tractor we ran or the man's name. I do remember that we only had about 1hp difference. I don't believe that is enought to worry about.

I was very happy to have the Big 4 come over and belt up.

http://www.98dodge.com/jerry/makotia5.jpg

The operator didn't want to pull this tractor for all it was worth, so I can not report a maximum hp for this one. The engine of this tractor sits right in the cab with the operator and it has a kick start on the back end of the crank shaft. This was the first time I got to see one of these monsters started. When we first started loading the tractor, it was only running on three cylinders. He shut down the engine and cleaned up a spark plug with a wire brush and a rag. When he restarted, all four were hitting. It is a nice sounding engine.

Some of you are probably wondering about the smaller gas tractors and the stationary engines. Yes, there were quite a bunch of both types but I don't have close ups of any.

[bear]

would of been nice to be there that big 4 would have sounded nice in the belt did any other big tractors belt up?

[jechrist2]

I think I need to start taking notes because I don't remember all the engines that came by. A couple that I do remember are: an IH A and a Rumley 6. I have been around a lot of A's, this was the first Rumly 6 I have seen. The 6 is a nice, smooth engine that ran very well. The owner had a copy of the owners manual that he showed. It appears to be a well built tractor.

[bear]

that rumely 6 would sound nice to but i'll bet that big 4 sounded better

[Mark / Ohio]

Great pictures! :thThumbsU

Reminds me of a question I've pondered but never asked. I noticed the belt is always twisted when connected. Is that to maintain the same direction of rotation on the wheels or does it help to keep the belt centered or some other reason?

[mbkerk]

Great pictures Jerry!

I was wondering if Mr. T was still around anywhere. I didn't see him at Rollag this year. He is looking well.

Where is Makoti anyway?

[jechrist2]

A reply to two Marks,

A good explanation I heard for twisting belts was actually a demo the person did. He took off his belt and tried to hold it out like a tape measure. When the belt is held horizontally it won't go out any distance at all. Now turn the belt vertical and try again. The belt is much stiffer and can be pushed out a ways. To keep this short story short, the belt is stiffer and doesn't jump up and down with the power impulses as much.

Another reason is for a side wind. The slack, or return side, of the belt would be on the side the wind is blowing from. Then when the belt is pulling the tight side will hold the loose side in line with the pulleys. This prevents the wind from blowing the belt off the pulleys.

Sometimes operators will run a straight belt, one with out a twist. Usually one end of the belt is "tipped over". That means the pulley on one end is on the inside of the belt and the pulley on the other end is being run by the out side of the belt. The picture of the Avery on the Red Brake at Rollag shows this type of belting.

To see the picture go to:

www.Rollag.com

click on the "Exhibits" button and then click on Prony Brake testing.



Mr. T is doing well. He had a couple very busy years on his farm the last couple years. To get to Makoti, drive north of Bismarck until you can see the lights of Minot. Then turn and go about 35 miles west. It is near Parshall.

[Mark / Ohio]

A reply to two Marks,
.....The belt is much stiffer and can be pushed out a ways. To keep this short story short, the belt is stiffer and doesn't jump up and down with the power impulses as much.

Another reason is for a side wind. The slack, or return side, of the belt would be on the side the wind is blowing from. Then when the belt is pulling the tight side will hold the loose side in line with the pulleys. This prevents the wind from blowing the belt off the pulleys.

Sometimes operators will run a straight belt, one with out a twist. Usually one end of the belt is "tipped over". That means the pulley on one end is on the inside of the belt and the pulley on the other end is being run by the out side of the belt. ...

Thanks for the explanation. I never thought about the twist helping with wind blowing and making the belt stiffer. Also thanks for the link to the picture running straight. I don't recall seeing that done before with the larger engines and long belts.

[40avery]

The main reason we run the belt on the 40 Avery in the "straight up" position with the twist top and bottom is for power. We get a few more belt horse power in the plowing position over the threshing position. It has to do with the geometry of the valve linkage on the Avery under mounts that allows the valves to travel a little farther each way in this position.

When possible it is better to run the other way because you can apply belt dressing to only one side of the belt. When you are running without a twist you must apply belt dressing to both sides and the typical "outside" of the belt can be quite dry and take a lot of compound to make it grip right.

[jechrist2]

Hi Rick,

I am happy you are home and healing.

Thanks for the info about running the straight belt and the need to "dress" both sides.

We need to get a belt well dressed on both sides next summer. Mark wants to go for a high horsepower. Maybe we should plan on running a horsepower test with a twist and then straight up. If we did that back-to-back we would have numbers to compare that have meaning.

Another thing I would like to do is belt an engine to a Baker Fan, run the engine up as fast as it will go and measure engine rpm. Then on the same day, with the same operator I would like to belt the same engine to a Prony Brake. We would load the engine until the engine is at the same rpm as on the Baker Fan. By doing this we could learn where on the horsepower curve the Baker Fan loads the engine. I would really like to do this with several engines to see if there is a fairly constant percent of maximum the Baker Fan holds an engine at.

[mbkerk]

The main reason we run the belt on the 40 Avery in the "straight up" position with the twist top and bottom is for power. We get a few more belt horse power in the plowing position over the threshing position.
I wish I would have learned this before we put her to bed for the winter! I was probably told, but forgot!:duh:

When possible it is better to run the other way because you can apply belt dressing to only one side of the belt. When you are running without a twist you must apply belt dressing to both sides and the typical "outside" of the belt can be quite dry and take a lot of compound to make it grip right.

I have never thought of this issue, but you are absolutely right! If wind is not a factor, can we just run it straight... without a wind twist?

We need to get a belt well dressed on both sides next summer. Mark wants to go for a high horsepower.
I'm game for that Jerry! Better chain that brake to something bigger than my B, and be sure you have plenty of cool water! I'm gonna make it boil! :bannana: :hide:

[jechrist2]

Maybe be better plan on doing that run on the Red Brake. With more cooling surface we can run longer without concern of over heating.

If we decide to run on the Blue Brake, we will find a tractor with more gravity in it so we don't have to worry about the Avery pulling us around the parade ground.

Jerry