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: JD 4010 Injection Pump Rebuild


lldill
10-05-2010, 04:10 PM
Hello, I am new on this site, and just posted this in the wrong forum--information. Sorry--I think I now have the hang of this.

I have been researching for several hours and have run across some extremely helpful info on this site. It appears that jdemaris should win a "guru-status" award for his posts regarding Stanadyne injection pumps. Those posts have already answered most of my questions, although a few remain.

I am repairing my JD 4010's injection pump, the Stanadyne DBGVC 631--1AJ, and am pondering whether the parts are common among these Stanadynes, or whether there are various blade sets, seal kits, pilot tunes, etc. for these pumps.

More specifically, will the parts which jdemaris suggested back in August 2010 for a JDB431 pump on a JD 310A, fit my 4010's DBGVC 631?

The JDB part numbers determined for that pump were:

Blade Set 32768 $13.32
Valve 15830 $13
Pilot Tube 16320 $8.14
Rebuild Kit 24371 $13.39
Governor Metal 29111 $45.37

Can anyone confirm that these JDB numbers are the same numbers I would use on my DBGVC 631.

Also, I understand that the vanes or blades part #32768 is an upgrade of #20803 (Spaco 090528) for low-sulfur fuels. Is this correct? Will the #32768 substitute for the #20803? Any reason not to buy the #32768 instead of the #20803?

Same query for the seal kit #06886 - any reason to not buy that instead of kit #24371.

If you are aware of any mismatch between the above parts and my pump, or if I have omitted some part that may be needed, I would appreciate a heads up.

Thanks in advance for any help you may be able to provide.

LD

jdemaris
10-05-2010, 07:55 PM
I am repairing my JD 4010's injection pump, the Stanadyne DBGVC 631--1AJ, and am pondering whether the parts are common among these Stanadynes, or whether there are various blade sets, seal kits, pilot tunes, etc. for these pumps.

More specifically, will the parts which jdemaris suggested back in August 2010 for a JDB431 pump on a JD 310A, fit my 4010's DBGVC 631?

The JDB part numbers determined for that pump were:

Blade Set 32768 $13.32
Valve 15830 $13
Pilot Tube 16320 $8.14
Rebuild Kit 24371 $13.39
Governor Metal 29111 $45.37

Can anyone confirm that these JDB numbers are the same numbers I would use on my DBGVC 631.

Also, I understand that the vanes or blades part #32768 is an upgrade of #20803 (Spaco 090528) for low-sulfur fuels. Is this correct? Will the #32768 substitute for the #20803? Any reason not to buy the #32768 instead of the #20803?

Same query for the seal kit #06886 - any reason to not buy that instead of kit #24371.



You can to the Deere parts website to verify some things - even though Deere no longer sells injection pump parts.

The JDB pump is a little newer then your DB pump. Off hand I don't remember exactly what is different, but you can tell pretty easy when you're looking at it.

For the rotary pump vanes, it goes like this. Old DB pumps used solid one-piece vanes made of a non-metal fiber material. They use a totally different all pot-metal end-cap (held on by four screws). I'm not sure if your DB pump has that style or not, but you can tell pretty easy just by looking in the Deere parts sheet, on-line. The newer setup uses two-piece steel vanes that are spring-loaded and self-adjusting. The end-cap for this set-up (also held by four screws) has a steel wear-plate that is separate. The low-lube,low-sulfur vanes will retrofit if you want. It's what the US Army uses now, and is that Stanadyne/Roosamaster calls their "arctic weather" kit. That because diesel fuel used in very cold temps is very low lube. The problem with low-lube fuels like kerosene, jet fuel, military fuel, and low sulfur fuel at the pump is - the sides of those metal vanes wear out, where they shuck back and forth. So, the special vanes are made of harder metal, and are a direct replacment for the standard spring-loaded vanes.

The front bushing, usually called a "pilot tube", is the same between both pumps. On some other make tractors, e.g. some Fords, the bushing is steel instead of brass. But, all the same with Deere.

The # 15830 is the same IF your pump had it orignally. Not all older DB pumps use a spring-loaded valve. Some have a vent-wire instead and sometimes have an extra bypass hose in the back. Again, not sure about the 2510 without looking it up.

The solid governor weight holder will fit the both, no problem.

If you can't tell what you're looking at at Deere parts, repost and I'll look.

lldill
10-08-2010, 03:51 PM
I called US Diesel--they were very helpful. After checking parts numbers, Marco told me that the bushings/pilot tubes are different--the DB uses a shorter one than the one listed above (although, he said that the longer one could be made to work). Also, he verified that indeed the vanes use a different number, as well as the liner.

I was not sure as to what I might get into with retrofitting the new metal vanes into this DB, so I merely opted to replace with the original number. Hopefully, these will nor succumb to low-sulfur issues like the interim metal ones. BTW, the existing vanes and ring check out fine, although this tractor has not been run much in the last twenty years, so it probably has not been victimized yet by low-sulfur fuels.

My DB does not use the check valve--simply has conventional plumbing into the body where the JDB has the valve.

The seal kit, pilot tube, vanes, liner, and updated governor ring are on their way. I will update with actual part numbers for future reference once they arrive.

I have mostly disassembled my pump, but have not yet removed the cam screw and, thus, not the rotor assembly/shaft (I thought I had a 45 torx I could make work, but, alas, I have virtually everything but--danged gremlins, again. Final disassembling will be later, after a trip into town).

I am doing this without the SM 2045, but I did find most of an online manual for a DB2 pump (nothing on reassembly, but I am trusting that to be relatively intuitive). I realize there are differences between the DB and the DB2, but I do not contemplate changing timing or fuel setting, so I opted to cut corners, not so much because the manual is too expensive, but because I suspect the manual will provide only tidbits of additional useful info, after which I will end up with another useless item I will need to store for my kids to sort through after I check out (I am trying to cut down on that, to the extent I can).

I suspect that the torque values, at least in the critical areas (such as head locating screw and head locking screws 180-220 "lb, cam screw - 440-480 "lb), are compatible between my DB and the DB2. If I am wrong on that, I'd appreciate someone giving me a heads up.

I will follow-up with actual numbers for this DBGVC 631 --1AJ once the parts have arrived, as well as comments on what I find once the rotor is disassembled.

Thanks JD for all the help so far--not just in this thread, but in numerous other relevant posts on various sites.

jdemaris
10-08-2010, 07:56 PM
I
My DB does not use the check valve--simply has conventional plumbing into the body where the JDB has the valve.


I tried to send you a private message with a link to place where you can download that Deere manual free. Hopefully you got the message?

Your pump probably does have a check valve, but it's in separate pieces and hooks in a different place.

lldill
10-09-2010, 07:35 PM
Thanks. No real surprises, but there are a few details I might have overlooked--possibly saved me a lot of grief as I was forging ahead in "pound foolish" mode.

All this reading has raised a few questions I otherwise would not have considered.

I am wondering whether the newer two-piece metal vanes may be usable in this DB model--it has no thrust plate on the head. Rather, the vanes thrust against the head itself. This is just academic, as I have the on fiber ones on order.

My pump has the early model end plate--separate strainer assembly from regulating piston and spring. I did remove and will reseal the strainer assembly; all is well there. I have removed the piston and spring from the sleeve, but not the sleeve. It is clean and the piston moves freely. I have no reason to have concern regarding the sleeve seals. Is there any good reason I should not bypass R&R of the end plate sleeve itself?

Also, how can I tell it I have a rotor plug hole plug or a delivery valve? The info is not all that clear. I do see in the bore what looks like a plug, but it will accommodate an allen wrench. I cannot tell what may be beneath it. I am inclined to not mess with the delivery valve even if I have one. Also, the info I read suggests replacing the valve stop if the valve is removed--I doubt the seal kit will have that.

Manual directs using a new cam advance screw. I'd not have thought of that. I suspect that this is not in the seal kit. Would it be neglectful of me to reuse the existing one? If not should I consider putting some thread-lock on it? I suppose if it failed, I could access it still on the tractor, without too much difficulty.

jdemaris
10-09-2010, 07:58 PM
I am wondering whether the newer two-piece metal vanes may be usable in this DB model--it has no thrust plate on the head. Rather, the vanes thrust against the head itself.

You can't use steel vanes unless you've got the end cap with the steel thrust plate. If the end cap is one-piece and pot-metal, you've got to stick with the fiber one-piece vanes.


Also, how can I tell it I have a rotor plug hole plug or a delivery valve? The info is not all that clear. I do see in the bore what looks like a plug, but it will accommodate an allen wrench. I cannot tell what may be beneath it. I am inclined to not mess with the delivery valve even if I have one. Also, the info I read suggests replacing the valve stop if the valve is removed--I doubt the seal kit will have that.

I've never seen a Roosamaster pump on any Deere that did not have a delivery valve. There is an Allen plug (with a hole in the center) that holds it in. If your pump was working, I guess you've got no reason to remove it. But, most seal kits DO come with a new stop.

Come to think of it, I don't think I've ever worked on any injection pump of any make that did not have a delivery valve, or valves - somewhere. CAV uses one per injector port, whereas Roosamaster uses just one for all cylinders. Yeah, I know the manual mentions some do not - but I have not idea where. Book also mentions that the plastic governor retainer is "optional", yet again - I've never seen a Stanadyne pump on any tractor built before 1985 that did not have it. That goes for Case, Ford, IH, Oliver, Hercules, Deere, Allis Chalmers, etc.


Manual directs using a new cam advance screw.

Can't say I've heard of anybody replacing that screw unless it was worn (which is rare), or it broke when being removed. I've broken many. If it feels real tight, you often have to rap it with a hammer first to shock it, or it will crack when you put too much twist on it.

lldill
10-11-2010, 07:27 PM
Well, the plastic ring on the governor weight retainer was cracked on each side of every rivet, allowing for nominal play between the retainer and the ring, but was still intact. This caused me to worry that the explanation for lack of output of my pump lies elsewhere. Thus, I wanted to leave no stone unturned, so I went ahead and removed the parts I was considering not removing, such as the delivery valve. The delivery valve did not come out readily. Not having the special removal tool, I flushed the bore with mineral spirits and then acetone, then whacked the the upper end of the rotor against a clean piece of soft plywood which was laying on the work bench. After two or three sharp raps, the delivery valve dropped out. I immersed the assembly in my parts washer and rocked it back and forth awhile until the valve no longer sticks. Seems to me unlikely that this valve was my problem, though--I don't think I would have gotten it out as easily, had it been stuck enough to resist the pressure created if fuel was being compressed by the plungers.

Although the plastic governor retainer ring was cracked on each side of each rivet, I have not found any obvious fault with the pump. The transfer pump parts show no wear.

Interestingly, my roller-to-roller dimension was right at 1.989. The spec for my pump calls for 1.959 plus or minus .0005. My tractor does have a turbocharger, which I really have not needed for my purposes, but it is there. Would a TC alter the prescribed roller-to-roller dimension? I have always had a bit more smoke than I thought I ought to have--maybe this is the explanation. Any reason I should not tweak this back to the prescribed dimension?

My new governor retainer doesn't have the timing mark--I expected that, based upon prior posts I have read. I intend to trace the outline of the old ring on paper, noting the mark, then scribe the new ring in the precise location of that mark. Any better ideas?

One more thing. I have epoxy and considerable experience using same, but wonder whether heavy duty thread-lock would suffice for retaining the pilot bushing. Any thoughts on that?