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John Deere 400 garden tractor?

123K views 36 replies 25 participants last post by  jerryh20 
#1 · (Edited)
just wondering if anyone here is familiar with a JD '400' lawn/garden tractor?

I went to pick up my new (to me) zero-turn from a dealer today, and sitting right next to it was a beautiful (and rather large) JD 400 garden tractor with a 20HP Kohler, hydrostatic drive with hi/lo range, power steering, a 60" deck, front PTO (unknown RPM), brand new looking rear 3pt. with arms and dual front hydraulic circuits on it (2 levers - 4 hydraulic ports) ... it fired right up and seemed to run/ride and mow just fine with the exception of a possibly ganky deck belt that slipped a little at first - the engine was smooth and quiet and it has an obviously upgraded seat with a suspension system and arm rests, so it's really comfy to drive

while I was excited to see a new looking 3pt. on the rear, I was equally unexcited to see that there isn't a rear PTO or any rear hydraulics on this tractor ... this leaves me wondering why on earth JD would omit something like a rear PTO or at least hydraulic lines to the rear of this tractor, especially when it's obviously designed for ground engaging implements ... what am I supposed to hang on this?

one thing I'm fairly concerned with is accessories for this - I was warned that some JD tractors will only accept one or two models of snowblowers and things like that, which would leave me with a giant, powerful lawn mower that does nothing else, which I definitely do not need

so ... I'm really hoping I can get some help from the MTF crowd on this one ... I can buy this tractor for what I think is a good price ($1000 or best offer) but I just can't do it if all I'm going to be able to use it for is mowing grass

is there a FEL made that will fit onto this 400 without having to fab up mounting brackets? ... the tractor certainly seems beefy enough to handle it, and I've seen photos of 400's with loaders on them (although I'm not sure if they are home made or not) ... Johnny Bucket makes a JBsr. for the 400 that makes use of the dual hydraulic circuits, but I would want something that lifts higher than a JB

which snow blowers will fit onto this 400 tractor? ... same with other accessories like blades and tillers and such ... will the same accessories that work on the 300 series fit and work on the 400?

what's the deal with the missing rear PTO? ... do the rear implements use a drive shaft that connects to the front system somehow? ... it has a nice factory 3pt. on it that is connected to the mower deck hydraulics, but the only thing I can see it being good for is dragging around unpowered accessories or the few that have their own engines on them

overall, is this a decent tractor? ... everything seems to work really good, and it drove and mowed really nice - but I just can't see adding a tractor that size to my stable if it's only going to be able to perform lawn mowing duty ... think it's worth $1000?

thanks for any help anyone can give - I'd like to make a decision on this within the next couple days if possible



I don't have a picture of the one I'm thinking of buying, but here's what it looks like (without the 3pt. arms)

 
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#3 ·
#4 ·
While the 400 is well respected by the classic JD crowd, it is not nearly as popular as the 425/445/455 series from what I can tell.

There are plenty of uses for a 3PH without hydraulics or PTO. blades, pallet forks, plows, disk harrows, cultivators, bed shapers, ballast boxes, boom poles, and lots of creative owner built tools.

For a front end loader, or-bilt.com (right there in MN) or ironmanfabrication.net may be able to modify one of their production loaders for the 400. I believe ironman had a model #13 loader for the 400, but doesn't currently advertise it on his website.

$1000 OBO is a decent price for a good heavy GT like this one.
 
#8 ·
While the 400 is well respected by the classic JD crowd, it is not nearly as popular as the 425/445/455 series from what I can tell.
The 400 was the first of the super garden tractors and it remains the heaviest of the gas powered Deeres. I have one and generally love it. While I might consider one the later 400 series mentioned above I honestly doubt they would have the brute power the old tank has.

Mine gets worked in the dirt a LOT with moldboard plow(it has 3 pt), tiller (it has rear PTO as well), and loader. Probably worked well beyond what it was designed for. While it has a few quirks I could do without if I could buy one today for $1,000 (and had a free grand to spend) I would jump on it.

Some pics of it here at Weekend Freedom Machines.
 
#6 ·
The 400 is pretty much attachment specific, loaders, rear hyd. kits, etc. are available aftermarket. That being said, they are a much sought after tractor!

I have a 420, a little newer, w/20 HP Onan, instead of the 20 HP Kohler, but over all a similar tractor. ~~ grnspot110
 
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#7 ·
the 400 is kinda special in that most of it's attachments are not compatible with the later 4XX series tractors and not compatible with the 300 series machines either. The frame is bigger than the latter 4XX tractors. The rear wheels are 6 lug, not 5, but the machine when new had ALL KINDS of goodies available for it, you just have to track them down on the used market. The rear 3 point is a $400 goodie alone, so at $1000 that's a pretty sweet deal!!!! It's a standard cat "0" 3 point so any attachment that size will fit.
 
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#10 ·
well, I've done some thinking and I'm going to go pick it up this weekend or Monday

I can always just make and run quick-connect hydraulic hose extensions from the front to the rear if I need hydraulics back there, right? ... I'd still like it a lot if there was a rear PTO on it ... maybe someone makes a hydraulically run 540 PTO I could mount back there or something ...

another question though ... is there a way to check if the front hydraulics work without having anything attached to them? ... I know that the power steering (seprate system?), mower deck and 3pt hydraulics work perfectly - should that mean that the front circuits are good as well? ... the hydrostatic drive was very strong and responsive as well, and is plenty fast in high-range

Alan, I'm very impressed with your 400, it's just beautiful! ... did that JD20 loader bolt right on, or was there significant fabrication and 'customizing' that was required first? ... FEL duty is really high on my wish list for this 400

thanks for all of the advice and input so far ... and the photos really helped me make up my mind (as well as providing my wife with evidence in a possible future divorce trial if I buy many more GT's)

naturally, I will post photos of my first ever John Deere (did I mention that?) when I get it back here
 
#13 ·
but would you part out a perfectly working 400?

that's a tough call to make - they are almost always worth more parted out (as are cars, trucks and motorcycles etc) but it would be hard for me to part it out unless there's something bad wrong with it ... it's so much easier to sell it all at once, but with eBay I guess it could be all at once

as far as wanting hydraulics and a PTO for the 3pt., it would allow me to use so many more attachments - and attachments like a tiller or brush hog that don't use a PTO or hydraulics need to rely on a separate IC engine, often having much less power and being less capable than one powered by the tractor

plus I'd like to be able to use powered 3pt. equipment normally reserved for front use like a bucket or snow blower - it's probably easier to find a 3pt. rear blower than the one that will bolt right on to the front of the 400

lastly, I want to be able to use cool gadgets like PTO generators and PTO hydraulic pumps

I've always wanted to take advantage of the variety of 3pt implements, especially powered ones, but the tractors I have (Case 224, Kubota G5200H and a Craftsman GT5000) don't have a 3pt. hitch or extra hydraulics/rear PTO on them

it is nice to know though, going into this, that I could get my money back (and then some) if it doesn't turn out to be a great tractor for me ... that's the only I'll buy something unless it's something really have to have
 
#14 ·
I had a 400, like someone above wrote they are serious tanks!

JD laid down the law when they introduced the 400 in 1975ish or so. I really liked the way the 60 inch deck stuck out so far on the left side. Man, talk about knocking out the weedeating to be done next to big hedge rows and such. It was great!
About the only thing I didn't like was the front PTO engagement, I had alot of problems with mine even replaced the whole mechanism a couple of times, the lever and cable that you pull to manually engage the PTO (front). Other than that, it was a monster and fun to use. For 1000 bucks it is a deal!
 
#15 ·
You won't be sorry you bought the 400, I always wanted a loader for my 400 but ended up with a Case 644 which was designed around the loader so the the front end and frame is allot beefier. I know that you can get a hydraulic rear pto and 3 point for your 224 that you can run all kinds of cool attachments with. The Case tractors are really underrated. The rear pto on the 400 is unique since it turns at 800 rpm and I think the front is 2000. All the attachment for the 400 were defiantly designed only for the 400. I have an extra rear pto but don't have the drive shaft if your interested. I could probably even be talked out of my tiller and pto but you would more than double your investment in the 400.
Alan you do have a nice 400. In your picture "digger - 7" is that a post hole auger? Is it a 540 rpm that you are running a little faster or is it the one that is for the 400?
 
#16 ·
Rabbit, the JD 20 was a bolt-on, I think the 400 was the only application for the 20.

CP7, the post hole digger is a Johnson/Arps and was the correct one for the 400. My personal opinion is that it turns way too fast, making me think it is just a 540 rpm model equipped with the correct PTO coupler for the 400 1"-15 spline output shaft.

I have worked the snot out of the 400, had it four years and I'm running about 150 hours a year. The first couple years didn't get all that much, it pulled a York rake in the summer and loaded salt in the winter. The last couple years it has been doing an increasing amount of tillage work. At the present it's dealing with around 2 acres of vegetable garden, either with a 12" Brinly plow or the 48", #35 Deere tiller. Working hard nobody will ever claim the flathead Kohlers are economy engines, this one will lap up about a gallon an hour.

I've been intimate with a couple other Deere garden tractors, a '64 110 and a '91 318. Both of them had ag tires and neither was particularly good in any sort of wet conditions. The 400 is packing 26x12.00-12 Swamp Witch ATV tires and the traction is amazing. I have had it in mud as deep as the front tires and it backed out. This spring I wallowed into a wet spot with the tiller and had to work out by pushing with the loader.

A loader will spoil you. I no longer strain to load compactors, generators or pumps and I'm loving it. I will even trailer the tractor to a job just to have it there for material and tool handling duties.
 
#20 ·
Rabbit, the JD 20 was a bolt-on, I think the 400 was the only application for the 20.
Alan, if I may but in here, I have a unidentified loader I got on a 314 Deere I just got done ressurecting. I was wondering of you had any more pictires of your 400 with the model 20 loader?
I have a suspicion that the loader on this 314 was originally on a 400. Other 400's with loaders I have seen pictures of use the same bucket as whats on mine. There are no tags on this loader i have and I have been trying to find out what loader it is so I can get a parts book for diagrams. Got a few issues I need to look into..

Thanks, Sam
 
#17 ·
Rabbit,
I have a 400 with a Loader, front and rear PTO's, Tiller, Gannon, and a 60" finish mower and I would be lost without it. Alan is sooo right that a Loader will spoil you because you find so many uses for it other than moving dirt, I'm so bad (lazy) that I fire up the 400 to move a gallon of paint from the front to the back of the house!!! Ted
 
#19 ·
I'm working through what would be required to put the loader pump on a seperate drive, making the loader hydraulics "live", so I won't have to run the rear PTO at the same time as the loader pump. It is both annoying and potentially dangerous to have the rear implement rotating when using he loader.

I'm thinking along the lines of adding a third groove to the crank pulley, then mounting the pump as high as possible between the frame rails. It will necessitate cutting the front stub off the PTO shaft at the front axle. No big deal as I cannot use front attachments with the loader installed anyhow.

There will need to be some way to disengage the pump for cold starting. I absolutely hate to have a hydro pump getting spun up in cold weather. With a diosconnect I can fire the engine, let it warm up and then idle it down and bring the loader pump online. Maybe no need for that but I think it helps with both pump and starter life.
 
#21 ·
#22 · (Edited)
This loader isnt a KwikWay. Had one of those before, and an Allis/Simplicity one too. This one seems closer to a Johnson Workhorse, though the bucket is different. The thing that makes me think it was for a 400 is that the side braces are too long. There are 4 holes in the front to mount and the forward pair of holes dont line up with anything on the tractor.



 
#24 ·
TerriLynn, you add hydraulic fluid in the back. Under the gas cap about a foot there is a square 90 degree fitting. Take the plug out and add fluid till you can see about 3/4 of an inch of fluid in the clear hose that goes through the hitch plate. This shouldnt have anything to do with the mower deck or the tractor dying. Can you spin the mower deck by hand? Be sure to check the oil level in the gearbox mounted to the mower deck. They are expensive to buy used or have rebuilt.
 
#25 ·
I spent $300+ on a deck driveshaft last year, and the gearbox isn't nearly that cheap. Keep it lubed. I'd guess you have something wrapped around the blades (the cheapest solution, then search further to you find what isn't turning) I'd also guess the whining is from the PTO belts squealing trying to turn the non turning gearbox.
 
#27 ·
Ok, $1k for a JD400 is a steal since you say it is in prime shape with a 3 pt and the deck. You can't go wrong.

The front/rear/power steering are all on the same hydraulic system. So if the front ports are not leaking then you should be fine.

The front PTO is a 2000 RPM PTO. The mid-PTO (where the mower deck shaft hooks up is a 2K RPM PTO as well. It's really the back side of the front PTO so...

The Rear PTO is really a gear reducer. It bolts up to the rear end and has a drive shaft that runs to the Mid-PTO. It takes the 2000 RPM's and reduces it to 840 RPM NOT 800. That is really a bummer because it kills all chances of using a rear mount mower unless you are brave enough to overspeed one meant to run at 540 RPM.

If you want to run a tiller for the 400, you will need the Rear PTO ($350-450, anything else is too expensive) and a 35 or 35A tiller (I have no idea what the difference is) The tillers generally sell in the $800-1000 range and only pop up occasionally on Ebay but they do show up.

You can mount a 4 way 54 inch front blade on front blade. They are in the $400-500 range, IIRC. You can get a blower for a 400 as well. It is hydraulically controlled as well. I don't track prices on those but generally $500 and up gets in the range. Both blades and decks show on a regular basis on Ebay and other places. You won't find them much on CL unless you happen to live in the Mid-West/North Central US. So you maybe in luck.

The 20 Loader is a bit of a rare piece but the St. Louis, MO CL has one for sale right now for $1500 but it needs some work. The frame bolts right onto the tractor, but you will need a couple hours and a buddy to do it the first time, ask me how I know. If you mount the loader, you can't mount a mower deck, only rear attachments so....make sure you have a need for a FEL or have a good back up mower.

There are a bunch of other attachments you can find for the 400 but they tend to be a little hard to find. Most attachments are indeed 400 specific but the most common ones folks need for mowing and snow removal are pretty easy to source.

I would buy it for $1k and if you don't like it, you can sell it for twice that on Ebay without too much sweat. Wait until the fall or next spring to do it though. :thThumbsU
 
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