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Electric line break in front yard???

4K views 26 replies 8 participants last post by  chaosracing 
#1 ·
How do I find where the break is without digging the whole front yard up. It's for a lamp post at the end of the driveway by the street.

It's about a 120 ft run.

Is there anything to use that wouldn't cost to much?

Would the electric company be able to find where the break is? How could I get them to come out for free?
 
#2 ·
Is your line in conduit or is it direct bury? If it's in conduit, tie a rope on the end and pull it back through and check the line.

I'm sure that there will be an electrician along soon that would know if there is a voltage sniffer that might help you out. I know there is one out there that will locate electric lines, I just don't know if there's one that will detect a break.
 
#3 ·
It's old school, direct bury. :(
 
#4 ·
if it was rated for direct burial the line won't just break, there is either a splice point buried, it is bad at a connection, or someone dug and hit it.

honestly it would be easier to replace the line than find the break with no signs of where to look. a toner works by sending a tone down 2 of the lines, you MIGHT get lucky and rent one tha twould work but i'd say no better than even odds. pro's will have better luck, but the cost could be higher than you trenching and replacing the line yourself.
 
#5 ·
What size wire would be best to use. It's just a single lamp post. Just wire in the ground, doesn't have to be to code, I will bury it in the dark.lol

I have a Mantis, wonder if I can make a nice slit in the ground with that?

I'm not doing it with conduit.
 
#7 ·
Just looked on the lowes site, wonder if they sell that just by the foot instead of buying a whole roll of 12/2F. This way I can get just what I need and not have any left over.

Didn't know that conduit is so cheap, 1/2" size is only $1.37 for 10 ft.
 
#9 ·
this very reason is why people use conduit in underground lines..... so the wire can b replaced without doing any digging..

ur line may b in conduit....have u checked to see if it is..??

if it isn't....then I suggest u do it t CODE.... electric lines r to b dug in 24 inches deep (or more).. u can go with direct burial... but if u have probs with varmits.. (gophers).. they do love to chew on electric wires.....they get a darn good charge outta doin that....lol

put the wires in a conduit....keeps the gophers at bay..
 
#10 ·
#12 ·
I know it not in Conduit, this area was dug earlier this year when I had a underground oil tank removed. When the contractors left they spliced the line together and it was working correctly for about 3 months.

Since then the light would work off and on. We had a lot of rain lately and now the light doesn't work at all.

I don't believe it has anything to do with what they spliced together though, the house is about 50 years old. We bought the house about 6 years ago, andI'm not really sure how long the line has been in there. But it's old.
 
#13 ·
I think the splice is the first place you should check out. Turn off the power at the panel for this circuit and dig up in the area of the splice. Confidence is high that the wires and splice are corroded. Probably just used regular wire nuts and not the ones filled with silicon. You should also have a GFCI protecting this circuit since it is outdoors and in a wet installation. You should be using wire nuts like these, they are filled with silicone and are for buried cable.
 

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#15 ·
I have a call into the contractor who dug the tank out if they can remember if they used the right wire nuts or not.

Also I picked up 6 of those wire nuts with the silicon for $3 at a Hardware store for #12 wire . Either to replace what I find or if I end up running a whole line. I measured it out today its about 90', so I would need to pick up a 100' roll if I have to go that way.

Can't do any digging today to check anything it's raining like crazy out all day.
 
#16 ·
Does the 90 feet include wire running up the light pole to the light socket and the length from the junction box in the house or outside junction box. You are going to want 6 inches of wire to work with making the splices at the junction box and inside the light pole. If so then 100 feet will work fine. If not buy the right length off a bulk roll at an electrical supply or big box store. Also pick up the GFCI for the power panel or a GFCI for an outlet that you can install ahead of the outside wiring. Once the GFCI is install you can connect other wiring to that GFCI using the terminals that are covered with tape. Look at the instructions in the box or ask for help. Easy to install and protect.
 
#17 ·
Wire Nuts Gone Bad!

Break in the Rain, I had a Chance to find Both Splices.

First one about 15' past where the tank was. It was in pretty Good Shape considering it had the wrong wire nuts.



These are the 3 wire nuts under that black tape.


I wired back up like this and put blackk tape on them.


Here is the bad connection that was just next to the sidewalk close to the front porch.

One wire nut completely gone, Must have arc'd under ground and melted.


Finally cleaned it up, you could see some greening on from corrosion.


One connection was by the shovel and the other by the sidewalk.
As you can see we had a ton of rain this morning and early afternoon.


Here are the 5 wire nuts I took off, 6th one never to be found.



One more thing, is this the right wire, if not I will get the contractor back to put in the right wire.

Here are a few pictures of it.





 
#19 · (Edited)
Sorry I missed that part. Yes it Works !!!!:thThumbsU

Sad part is past the shovel the wire shot straight down to about a foot and half deep. I will just remember not to airate there since I know it is there now.

I was at work when they tied this wire back in so I really had no idea what they had done or exactly where it is. I know now though!:fing32:

Thanks for everyone's help.
 
#20 ·
Glad you got it fixed, however if it was me I would dig a new trench 2 feet deep and lay down gray 3/4" pvc conduit, also known as schedule 40. You are going to need pvc glue, 2 elbows to exit the trench up the wall and lamp post, a service elbow, a GFCI receptical which could be put on the wall outside of the house which would also protect the light pole, and 100' of 12 gauge stranded wire THHN in three colors green,white, and black. You aren't suppose to run pvc jacketed wire in schedule 40 conduit. Yes it is going to cost more than the splices cost, but you have open yourself to future problems using them and vulnerable to others with the shallow depth. You could even wire up an outlet at the light pole. Never know when that might come in handy.
 
#21 ·
We had a 220 wire like that with GFI and everything ran to our swimming pool out back. Hired a guy with a trench digger and then an electrician. Two Seperate breakers in breakers box for receptable out by the pool and on/off switch by pool. They ran the wire through the pipe like you said strands of wires and everything.
Township Permits etc., it cost alot.

If I either start digging out there myself or hire a guy to use a trench digger out there the neighbors will be calling the township to make sure I have a permit. I rather tear down the light then go to all that expense for 1 single light post.

I think I will just let it be the way it is rather then a large bill for a single light.

I do appreciate all your help though in his matter. You all have been very helpful.
 
#22 ·
Your welcome, and I can appreciate the costs but in the case of a pool the last thing you want is someone to be electrocuted. The same reasoning applies to all electrical work. Inspections and permits keep one safe. Many stories can be told where a weekend electrician buried junction boxes in the wall or tapped off one side of a 220 line to supply a bedroom, or removed an electric hot water heater and installed a gas water heater with no vent pipe. Just let the exhaust vent in the basement. Better to be safe than dead.
 
#23 ·
You can delete all the wireing....& go with a new Solar light...has a rechargin battery in it...

there is a bad corner on a hiway southeast of us....the county has a new Solar warning signal light system installed on that elbow kissin corner.... it is triggered to come on when you are 1/4 mile from it... it is awesome to see it work....
 
#24 ·
I have no problems with Permits. Really they are well worth it to get the job done up to code and installed correctly.
For a Pool a permit is definitely the way to go to assure safety.
The Light Post has been there a long time, possibly over 40 years old. The wire is in the ground over a foot and half deep except for that 15 ft span I dug up. Years ago when it was installed it probably was up to code back then.

I rather not use it then pay the expense now to bring it back up to code since it's only one light.

Solar lights never seem to be bright enough except like the ones you see the electric company put up along the highways on telephone poles. They must be really expensive?
 
#25 ·
Years ago,I saw a guy use an AM radio tuned to a blank spot on the dial,to locate a break in an underground electric cable--he listened to it as he walked along the path he thought the cable was laid in,and claimed when he got to the point where it had failed,he heard a loud AC hum or buzzing noise...I guess it worked,because he only had to dig up maybe 5 feet of it before he found the break in it...

Mechanics have used a compass to find shorts in car wiring,it will deflect the needle as you move it along the suspected areas of the harness that might be shorted out...my shop teacher had a "inductive ampmeter" that worked much the same way too...he said you could substitite a light bulb in place of a fuse using jumper wires to aid in locating shorts,it will remain lit up if the wires are shorted,and go out when the short is repaired...seen a electricial use a 100W bulb in an old houses screw in type fuse box to do just that once...
 
#27 ·
If it was me, I would rent a ditch witch, dig a new trench, put conduit in and put in proper wire and a GFCI breaker. Then that way its 100% correct and wont have issues at the 2 splice points that will fail again.
 
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